Figure that one out, if you can.
Figure that one out, if you can.
Are you saying that we have a tendency to think our own athletes are clean but foreign athletes are dirty?
I tend to agree. I've gotten in arguments with Jonathan Gault about this very thing. He goes off often about the Aden athletes and I point out there haven't been any real bans since the raid.
rojo wrote:
Are you saying that we have a tendency to think our own athletes are clean but foreign athletes are dirty?
I tend to agree. I've gotten in arguments with Jonathan Gault about this very thing. He goes off often about the Aden athletes and I point out there haven't been any real bans since the raid.
The difference is that Aden's athletes have been found with EPO and steroids in their hotel room, these are hardcore drugs which unequivocally have direct and significant benefit on the athlete's performance. Whereas Salazar was gaming the system by edging up the regulatory limits on recovery substances and techniques such as L-Carnitine, a legal substance within limits. L-Carni is not going to make a decent runner world class, but EPO and steroids can result in significant improvements bringing a no name to the fore.
Additionally, Salazar assured his athletes that what he was doing was legal, which concurs with the report by the USADA:
"the Panel was struck by the amount of care generally taken by Respondent to ensure that whatever new technique or method or substance he was going to try was lawful under the World Anti-Doping Code"
It all makes it *seem* like Salazar had, for his athletes, there best interests at heart, but let things get out of hand. So, whether this was an act by Salazar or not, it makes it seem like his athletes are intentionally innocent, if not naive.
Aden on the other hand, with the mix of hard core drugs and evidence make his athletes appear guilty with intent.
Both killed the rules, Aden's actions were first degree homicide, Salazar's were manslaughter.
In both cases, something died. Lets hope we and the USADA learn something from this.
^ Splitting hairs.
Farah was directly connected to both of them! You'll get to see him prance around the streets of Chicago next weekend though.
El Keniano wrote:
^ Splitting hairs.
Absolutely not. The difference is night and day.
The difference is.... wrote:
rojo wrote:
Are you saying that we have a tendency to think our own athletes are clean but foreign athletes are dirty?
I tend to agree. I've gotten in arguments with Jonathan Gault about this very thing. He goes off often about the Aden athletes and I point out there haven't been any real bans since the raid.
The difference is that Aden's athletes have been found with EPO and steroids in their hotel room, these are hardcore drugs which unequivocally have direct and significant benefit on the athlete's performance. Whereas Salazar was gaming the system by edging up the regulatory limits on recovery substances and techniques such as L-Carnitine, a legal substance within limits. L-Carni is not going to make a decent runner world class, but EPO and steroids can result in significant improvements bringing a no name to the fore.
Additionally, Salazar assured his athletes that what he was doing was legal, which concurs with the report by the USADA:
"the Panel was struck by the amount of care generally taken by Respondent to ensure that whatever new technique or method or substance he was going to try was lawful under the World Anti-Doping Code"
It all makes it *seem* like Salazar had, for his athletes, there best interests at heart, but let things get out of hand. So, whether this was an act by Salazar or not, it makes it seem like his athletes are intentionally innocent, if not naive.
Aden on the other hand, with the mix of hard core drugs and evidence make his athletes appear guilty with intent.
Both killed the rules, Aden's actions were first degree homicide, Salazar's were manslaughter.
In both cases, something died. Lets hope we and the USADA learn something from this.
DING DING DING
The difference is.... wrote:
The difference is that Aden's athletes have been found with EPO and steroids in their hotel room, these are hardcore drugs which unequivocally have direct and significant benefit on the athlete's performance. Whereas Salazar was gaming the system by edging up the regulatory limits on recovery substances and techniques such as L-Carnitine, a legal substance within limits.
And meds. And let's not forget about the testosterone - see the decision pdf:
1) Salazar was a testo cheat as athlete
2) Salazar coached testo cheat Decker
3) Salazar was seen with testo around his athletes in 2008 while not having a prescription
4) Salazar's own testo levels went down after he obtained a larger testo prescription
5) a witness reported that "Alberto Salazar’s athletes" used "thyroid and testosterone therapy"
6) "a Galen Rupp medical record from 2002 that included the line “Presently on prednisone and testosterone medication”."
7) Salazar routinely send the professional masseuse away to give Rupp private massages behind closed doors
One could argue that points 2) and 3) resemble the Aden situation, and 5) and 6) are a lot worse. The rest completes a very dark story.
Alright, alright, alright... wrote:
Farah was directly connected to both of them! You'll get to see him prance around the streets of Chicago next weekend though.
Rupp = thyroid meds, asthma inhaler TUE, L carnitine, testosterone cream
Farah = thyroid meds, asthma inhaler TUE, L carnitine, testosterone cream, EPO, steroids
testosterone his steroid, and no one know what else salazar gave his athletes beside the one he got caught with
The USADA investigation is as thorough an investigation as is going to happen. They did not find that Alberto had given any of his athletes anything that was illegal. Not even one! So you can assume whatever you want, but there is no evidence to support your position. What would it take for you to decide that he had not given PED's to his athletes?
The difference is.... wrote:
Whereas Salazar was gaming the system by edging up the regulatory limits on recovery substances and techniques such as L-Carnitine, a legal substance within limits.
Please stop with this. There is no limit to the amount of L-Carnitine an athlete can take. There may be a practical limit to how much can be infused.
Law_5 wrote:
The USADA investigation is as thorough an investigation as is going to happen. They did not find that Alberto had given any of his athletes anything that was illegal. Not even one! So you can assume whatever you want, but there is no evidence to support your position. What would it take for you to decide that he had not given PED's to his athletes?
A warning or lighter ban by USADA instead of a potentially career-ending 4 year ban. ?
id say he either got them to blood dope,or gave them EPO.judging by sifan hassan's physique,and especially her rock hard abs,id say he used clenbuterol as a fat burner,plus anavar or stanazolol.maybe even both.plus human growth hormones.if he gave his athletes EPO,as well as steroids and hgh no wonder they improved out of sight.
East Coast poor wrote:
Alright, alright, alright... wrote:
Farah was directly connected to both of them! You'll get to see him prance around the streets of Chicago next weekend though.
Rupp = thyroid meds, asthma inhaler TUE, L carnitine, testosterone cream
Farah = thyroid meds, asthma inhaler TUE, L carnitine, testosterone cream, EPO, steroids
+1
That's the difference between the two. But according to some bright sparks in this thread, it will always be something contained in Farah's East African genes.
jeff tallon wrote:
id say he either got them to blood dope,or gave them EPO.judging by sifan hassan's physique,and especially her rock hard abs,id say he used clenbuterol as a fat burner,plus anavar or stanazolol.maybe even both.plus human growth hormones.if he gave his athletes EPO,as well as steroids and hgh no wonder they improved out of sight.
I'd like to know if there is any connection between Salazar and Aden. I mean documented interactions.
Salazar didn't/doesn't need to inject Farah or Hassan with EPO directly when he can just send them to Africa every winter and perhaps tip them off with the right 'contact numbers'.
Why was he coaching foreign athletes anyway? Shouldn't an American coach, funded by an American company, be coaching just the best American talent?