Best Miler

I'd probably agree with Herb Elliott in terms of results; in terms of pure natural talent, few could match Roger Bannister - first 4-minute mile off 30 miles a week.

...among the top 10 milers of all time, with each one at the height of their abilities, my money is on Sebastian Coe.

Did Bannister run that on a cylinder gravel track?

Jim Ryun without a doubt. Beat the olympic champion as a high schooler, world record holder, but unfortionatly never ran well at the olympics kinda like El G

Herb Elliott is the greatest miler as far as performance is concerned -- nevetr lost a 1500m or mile and won the Olympic championships in WR time.

Steve Scott, though, is the best with respect to durability and consistency. Under 4 minutes 136 times, and ranked top in the world from 1977 to 1988.

Yes, Bannister's run was on cylinder gravel track. That stuff is like running in quick sand. Probably could take off 10-15 seconds on todays fast rubber tracks.

Do you think it would have helped if guys like Ryun had our shoe technology today.

What! That means a 3:49-3:44 mile if we were to time warp the guy to 2002. C'mon on 30 miles a week? We will never know, but it is something I'd like to see. MY personal vote is for Snell because I just like the pure animal sense about the guy.

I voted for El G, but I can't believe nobody has mentioned Morceli.

Ryun on talent, Elliot on competitiveness.

Coe and Ovett get the nod for intriguing match-ups, in both head to head and breaking each other's marks (edging Walker and Bayi, who came up too brief).

Scott got handed his head too many times in Europe in races he maybe should have won to be taken seriously in this thread.

i would vote for john walker

El G. is undoubtedly the best in a rabbited race. In championship races run in 3:30 or slower, I would go with Morceli, then Coe.

Everyone should check out Jim Ryun's 3:51.1. I can't say whether the tracks then were that much slower(they have to be somewhat) but Ryun ran alone the whole race and still cranked a 52 or 53 last lap. Watching him in full flight I have to think he was the greatest talent ever, like Henry Rono in the distances.

Morceli was pretty scary as well. At the height of his reign there was no one who could touch him. His last lap at worlds in 95 was a 51.0 and it was a pretty fast time too, I think 3:30-3:32 at worst.

Coe was the only man every to win two golds in the 1500. That must put him in contention. The race in 84 played out perfect for him but he also ran flawlessly, like a man determined that NO One was going to beat him that day. You can see that in him every step of the race.

Elliot was undefeated but had a short career. HIs 3:35 demolishing of the 1960 1500 field was the most dominant championship 1500 ever.

But El Gerrouj in my mind is the best ever. 99 worlds in 3:27 blew my mind. His list of top times are staggering. He's probably the most dedicated and single minded miler ever(I doubt if John Walker or Ovett lived anything like the lifestyle and daily regimn El G lives. He uses rabitts in championship races so you can never say he has the devestating sprint that some of the other milers had but he's the fittest, strongest miler ever and why would he need to gamble on a bogus jog kick title like you used to see in many of the championships of the recent past. What blows my mind is how easily he carries his arms when running 55 point 400 pace and even how doesn't look like he's working that hard when he's in his finishing sprint. Cram used to pump his arms really high and coe lookes like a dervish with his veins sticking out of his neck when he kicked. I thing El Gerrouj is the best ever, without winning an Olympic title. But I suppose you can use the same rational and say Kannouchi is the greatest marathoner. He wins marathons that have better fields than the Olympic marathon does these days anyways.

Don't forget though, El G. has been in 2 O.G.'s, without a title (granted he fell in '96) and he also lost the Grand Prix final in the late 90's. In other words, a decent percentage of his most important races, he has come up without a victory.

I agree that he is the the fittest and strongest miler ever....but his stretch kick may not be quite as good as a couple of other all-time milers. I still think that he was capable of beat Ngency in 2000, but did not 'grit his teeth' like a Coe would have. Unless he were running a 3:28-29 type of race, he would get kicked down by Morceli and another miler or 2.

guest wrote:

Ryun on talent, Elliot on competitiveness.

Coe and Ovett get the nod for intriguing match-ups, in both head to head and breaking each other's marks (edging Walker and Bayi, who came up too brief).

Scott got handed his head too many times in Europe in races he maybe should have won to be taken seriously in this thread.

Scott?

What Coe/Ovett matchups. They avoided each other like the plague.

Elliot on competitiveness? He quit at the top of his game because he was afraid to lose. He was certainly great but I'm not sure he's the best ever.

El G and Morceli are very similar careerwise. Tough call between the two.

URnot4real.

I have no idea if "Scott?" is supposed to be an agreement or disagreement.

Coe and Ovett: learn to read more accurately. I wrote head to head (the centerpiece of the Moscow Games, plus the 78 European 800 meters against Olaf Beyer) and breaking each other's marks (not in the same race). These are ALL match-ups. A person doesn't have to be in the same race to compete/match-up with someone else, record-wise. If you don't believe these two were the most intriguing thing going on in Track and Field in their time, go back and read the coverage of their every move vis-a-vis each other.

Elliot quit for the same reason lots of people did back then: it was time to get on with life. Most Track athletes didn't compete long into their twenties...there wasn't any money to be had and starting a family meant something back then. Usually, it meant getting a real world job. Wedding vows were strong commitments, not to be taken lightly, especially by women who didn't work outside the home and had to choose a good provider. Elliot had done it all, Mile and 1500 records, plus gold medal. Yes, I did see the video "Supermilers" where he talks about being scared. He was being honest--courage isn't the abscence of fear, but the conquering of it--but if you notice, whatever fears he may have felt certainly didn't keep him from toeing the line. And once the gun went off, he channeled that fear into action, and God help the others in the race. (Remember in the video where he said he felt so nervous during the Rome Olympic race, he decided the best thing to do was take the lead and run as fast as he could? *THAT'S* a competitor!)

"When I race my mind is full of doubts..who will come in second..who will

come in third.." - Nouredinne Morcelli

He was the man. I saw him training the other day. I hear he's making a comeback.

Nouredinne Morceli.

Ranked number one the world 7 years in a row (1990-1996). Took Aouita's WR from 3:29 to 3:27 and Cram's WR from 3:46 to 3:44. World Champ in 91, 93 and 95 and Oly Champ in 96. Goodwill Champ in 94. He was sick shorlty before the 92 Games but broke the WR that year. He won almost every race that he ran in no matter the pace. How many times did he win at Zurich? (By the way, El G didn't just fall in 96, he foolishly ran up on Morcel's heal and deserved to trip to the back. That may have prevented him from being the best ever at this point but he still has time to make it up)

El Garage-door may be the best ever if he wins the gold next time around. His competitive record against several great Kenyans is unmatched and his record setting is historic.

Until then, I stay with Elliot.

--maybe even then! Elliot certainly didn't have an EPO question hovering over him. Not that El Garage-door does, but it's 2002 and sadly no one is to be taken at face value.