WARHURST - I demand an explanation

Ellerton has run 1:49 at least 3 times. What is Ruff's PR? Ellerton always runs fast when it counts!!

Yeah from what I hear Nate wants to sacrifice his teams chances to get to Natioanls so that his Canadian buddies get represented. You may not believe this but unlike his former teammate Nate believes in Warhurst and will lead Warhurst do the coaching. That being said, I heard that Nate wont run NCs unless Elerton runs the 1200, he runs the mile, Stephanie Hirtle (girl from BC) runs the 800 and Nathan Taylor (guy from BC) runs the 400.

You are an idiot.

Hey, runner2, what part of Canada are you from?

I guess you call running 1.49 in Ann Arbor All Comers meets with pacers running when it counts.

When it counts is World Junior Championships (after the All Comers meets). At WJ Ellerton went in as the 2nd. fastest qualifier, yet didn't even make the finals.

I call 8th. place in the semi's with 1.52.08 gagging when it counts, not "always running fast when it counts".

Ruff's 2003 indoor PR is faster than Ellerton's and that should be the only criteria - otherwise why even have them square off on 1/25?

What exactly do you and Warhurst have against a hard-working kid from Detroit?

Friend, I'll bet Ronnie gets in the office in the morning tomorrow, Monday. Why don't you give him a call and pose your question to him? If he doesn't respond, drive over and find him. Quit wasting our time w/your concerns.

My take on it is that every coach uses a combination of science (times) and art (gut instinct) to determine relay legs. This may not apply to this DMR situation...but bet I'm not far off.

Years ago my college team had 3 guys 3:57, 4:00, & 4:02. Coach ran 3 of us others in a mile to determine the 4th for the following week's national level relay. I beat the other two 4:11 to 4:15, & 4:17. Coach took the 4:15 guy. I asked why. Coach said he could see something in the other guy, blah, blah. The guy then ran the relay the next week in 4:04. No, I was not yet ready to run that fast. The point is: There are many things internally that a coach sees and knows that outsiders are not privy to. Do you think for a second Warhurst would put an inferior relay on the track? Just leave it to people close to the scene who know a hell of a lot more than us outsiders.

Rev. Jackson wrote:

Ruff's 2003 indoor PR is faster than Ellerton's and that should be the only criteria - otherwise why even have them square off on 1/25?

What exactly do you and Warhurst have against a hard-working kid from Detroit?

Ronnie has nothing against Rondell. He loves the kids heart and work ethic and on more than one occasion has mentioned how he wished all of his kids were like Rondell.

But who are you to tell Warhurst what his "only" criteria for selecting HIS team should be.

Simple facts: Ellerton has the faster PR (by 5 sec) and more experience, and his workouts indicated he was much fitter than his race against Ruff showed.

Looks like the strategy worked, Ellerton runs his 3rd or 4th fastest time ever in a pressure packed situation and they made the big dance. End of story

you can NOT be serious with this thread.

Rev Jackson, The two other times Ellerton ran sub 1:50 he led from start to finish. Actually, at the Ontario high school Champs, Ellerton went to the meet with only about two months of training under his belt. He was a virtual unknown - led the race from start to finish and won by about 4 sec - 1:49.7.

As a Michigan track alum, national champ, all-american and former team captain, I respect and value all opinions expressed by the coaches. I also have a great deal of respect for ALL the athletes since I was one of them for 5 years. I give them alot of credit to go down to the crappy indoor track day in and day out to train! If you have a problem with RON's decision (he is in fact the HEAD COACH) why don't you ask him yourself. As far as he is concerned, his goal was to qualify the relay this weekend. Many things can change come NCAA's and teams are not required to run the same athletes. Rondell may earn a spot on the relay come March.

But if you look at the 2003 indoor performances now, Ellerton is 4 secs faster than Rondell.

Sadly, tennis wanna, this IS a serious thread. There are, no doubt, arm chair experts populating the country that are sure they could do a better job of coaching than guys like Ron W. Equally sad is they use forums like this to vent their spleens and make ill-advised accusations. What makes this situation sadder yet is skin color is made to be an issue.

Another Canadian point of view.

The head-to-head race results didn't indicate that Ellerton was fitter.

Don't you think that kids as special as Ronnie thinks Rondell should be rewarded for their work ethic and heart?

Who is to say that Rondell would not have gotten pulled along to an indoor PR of 1.49, equivalent to Ellerton's?

Even if Ruff didn't run 1.49, with studs Brannen and Willis on the relay you are actually saying that the team would not have been competitive and wouldn't have "made the big dance"?

If you really are Sully, you also need to look in the mirror.

Rev. Jackson wrote:

The head-to-head race results didn't indicate that Ellerton was fitter.

Don't you think that kids as special as Ronnie thinks Rondell should be rewarded for their work ethic and heart?

Who is to say that Rondell would not have gotten pulled along to an indoor PR of 1.49, equivalent to Ellerton's?

Even if Ruff didn't run 1.49, with studs Brannen and Willis on the relay you are actually saying that the team would not have been competitive and wouldn't have "made the big dance"?

You make a number of ridiculous points.

First, who cares that much about one head-to-head race? One race is the only indicator of who is better? Who in their right mind would put in a 1:53ish guy (I don't know the other guy's actual PR) over a multiple 1:49 guy?

Second, I think I'm special and work hard. Maybe he should have put me in? Are you saying that Ellerton is lazy and undeserving?

Third, no one knows that Rondell wouldn't have run 1:49 if he had run. He might also have become the first man sub-1:40. Who is to say that if he had run, we wouldn't have choked and run 2:15?

And fourth, are you saying that since Michigan had Brannen and Willis on their team, they might as well have put the slower guy in anyway since they still would have done well?

In conclusion, you are either this guy's father or perhaps himself.

I stick by my earlier post recommending you get in touch w/Ron about your concern. Again, altho not knowing the details of the situation, I have to believe Ron feels good about his choice and would add that based on what Sully had to say, torn about letting Ruff get a chance.

Yes, it LOOKS like a win-win situation on paper but a coach has to make the tough calls and went w/who he felt would be the superior players. Science and art help explain the decision often. You have to admit Ellerton did the job.

Give it up. Ruff knew he had no chance for Boston.

Coach Warhurst always goes with the foreigner that he has awarded the scholarship to, as opposed to the non-scholarship city walkon.

Tennis wanabe - You took the words right out of my mouth!!

In fact, Ellerton went into World Juniors ranked 24th in the World, not 2nd. He came out 14th. He ran a 1:49.45 heat in his first international race to qualify for the semi-finals. His slow time in semis was mainly a matter of tactical inexperience - he chose to follow the Africans, expecting a fast first 400m like the 51.6 Kipchirchir ran in Ellerton's heat. Instead, they went through in 55.9 and the pace still hadn't heated up by the 600m. Ellerton even-splitted, but couldn't keep up in the final 200m. He learned a lesson he probably won't repeat. By the way, he won the Canadian Juniors a week later - not as big as the World's, but no Twilight meet either. With regards to Ron's decision, it probably was a tough one. But he's got to look down the road to NCAA's and guess who's going to be running faster at that point. Ellerton had run only three races and was starting to round into shape.

Rev. Jackson wrote:

When it counts is World Junior Championships (after the All Comers meets). At WJ Ellerton went in as the 2nd. fastest qualifier, yet didn't even make the finals.

I call 8th. place in the semi's with 1.52.08 gagging when it counts, not "always running fast when it counts".

Ruff's 2003 indoor PR is faster than Ellerton's and that should be the only criteria - otherwise why even have them square off on 1/25?

What exactly do you and Warhurst have against a hard-working kid from Detroit?

The Rever-uhnd Jack-son, not only do you not know running, you don't even know who the players are on this message board.

OF COURSE KEVIN SULLIVAN IS REALLY SULLY! He isn't some trembling pimply internet kid playing make-believe.

I don't see you identifying yourself, mal-mow, so you must be some pock-marked, 300lb. swedish meatball masquerading as a track know-it-all.

malmo needs no indification....

GaryB wrote:

malmo needs no indification....

identification