BSX Insight Wearble Lactate Threshold Monitor

You know you can always just learn how to run by feel like the Kenyan and Ethiopian runners do.

pray tell, define running by feel

do tell wrote:

pray tell, define running by feel

Easy: run just fast/far enough that you see improvement in your fitness and subsequently, your race results.

Wow. That is quite insightful. You'd make an excellent coach. lmaoTo the OP's question. This technology looks promising and there is research behind it. It depends on what they deliver.

Kenyans come from Kenya wrote:

do tell wrote:

pray tell, define running by feel

Easy: run just fast/far enough that you see improvement in your fitness and subsequently, your race results.

It is more about applying the info one gains.

It has been easy and pretty cheap to measure blood lactate for a while now.

I do think that one can train just fine without it.

Actually, it's not fun or cheap.

My issue is that it is not real time. It will measure LT and then give you pace(s). However, LT can change over time and under different conditions. It does say in the FAQ that they are working on a real-time measurement. However, with crowd-funded projects you never know if the product will even come to market.

measuring "blood lactate" is like carrying a compass around when you can see the sun. If you can't trust your own senses, you'll never get anywhere. When my pH drops, I first feel it in my hands. Whatever pace that happens is "lactate" threshold.

Directly measuring lactate itself is particularly stupid because it doesn't interfere with muscle activity at all. Low pH does, but that's never been proven to be directly associated with lactogenesis, despite being roughly concurrent.

How did you initially know that it was your pH dropping that was causing the feeling in your hands.

Bad Wigins wrote:

measuring "blood lactate" is like carrying a compass around when you can see the sun. If you can't trust your own senses, you'll never get anywhere. When my pH drops, I first feel it in my hands. Whatever pace that happens is "lactate" threshold.

Directly measuring lactate itself is particularly stupid because it doesn't interfere with muscle activity at all. Low pH does, but that's never been proven to be directly associated with lactogenesis, despite being roughly concurrent.

Because that same feeling progresses up my arms and eventually leads to or toward rigging, as it has always done in decades of repeats of 400 to 1000 meters and mid distance races.

Seriously, if you can't feel the acid, then it must not even affect you so why worry about it at all?

Perhaps you don't realize how ignorant those statements are.

Bad Wigins wrote:

Because that same feeling progresses up my arms and eventually leads to or toward rigging, as it has always done in decades of repeats of 400 to 1000 meters and mid distance races.

Seriously, if you can't feel the acid, then it must not even affect you so why worry about it at all?

I'd like to know how much more accurate something like this is versus say, just running and a couple races and triangulated your threshold paces off of those.

It doesn't seem like Canavo is out there measuring his athletes mmols of lactate or whatever. Instead he's just basing each days paces of their 5k or marathon paces.

Seems a heck of a lot cheaper and easier than buying a threshold monitor and also a lot more accurate than running off of feel.

Most runners are downright terrible at telling how they feel. I train with people who have been running for 10-20 years and most of them have almost zero ability to run off effort. I think running off of effort is possible, but it is its own talent.

1) In determining your LT? A lot more accurate.2) How many athletes is Canovo(sic) coaching?3) Yes.

heyyo wrote:

I'd like to know how much more accurate something like this is versus say, just running and a couple races and triangulated your threshold paces off of those.

It doesn't seem like Canavo is out there measuring his athletes mmols of lactate or whatever. Instead he's just basing each days paces of their 5k or marathon paces.

Seems a heck of a lot cheaper and easier than buying a threshold monitor and also a lot more accurate than running off of feel.

Most runners are downright terrible at telling how they feel. I train with people who have been running for 10-20 years and most of them have almost zero ability to run off effort. I think running off of effort is possible, but it is its own talent.

jessev wrote:

Perhaps you don't realize how ignorant those statements are.

If you're gonna be cocky, at least try to back it up.

besides which, you, "do tell" and "coach x" are obviously the OP desperately trying to sell this crap. You give yourself away by language and by instantly rebutting every negative comment about your product.

You should notice by now that you're not doing so well. There may be a lot of stupid people reading this board, but very few are too dull to detect a sales pitch.

btw your product is garbage.

1) Please expound upon that? You obviously are the guy trying to sell this so tell us more. How much more accurate? Say I just ran a 1:10 half. McMillan translates that to 52:30 10 miler, which is 5:15 pace. If I go do my LT workouts at 5:15 pace, how far off of LT could I be on any given day (5 secs per mile, 10 secs, etc.)? More importantly, what kind of negative impacts will that have on my training versus using this monitor? Or rephrased, what kind of positive training improvements can I expect if I use the BSX. Holding all else equal, i.e. exact training regime, but instead of basing my tempos/progression runs/long intervals off of my half time, I use the BSX monitor, how much faster will I be in 6 months than if I hadn't used it?2) HUH? What are you getting at? Why is how many athletes Canova coaches relevant to my point? The point is the best coach in the world is able to assign is athletes rough pace guidelines and it seems to work as they dominate the athletes of the other coaches.3) Yes what?

Pol wrote:

1) In determining your LT? A lot more accurate.

2) How many athletes is Canovo(sic) coaching?

3) Yes.

heyyo wrote:

I'd like to know how much more accurate something like this is versus say, just running and a couple races and triangulated your threshold paces off of those.

It doesn't seem like Canavo is out there measuring his athletes mmols of lactate or whatever. Instead he's just basing each days paces of their 5k or marathon paces.

Seems a heck of a lot cheaper and easier than buying a threshold monitor and also a lot more accurate than running off of feel.

Most runners are downright terrible at telling how they feel. I train with people who have been running for 10-20 years and most of them have almost zero ability to run off effort. I think running off of effort is possible, but it is its own talent.

Truer wrote:

Actually, it's not fun or cheap.

$400 gets you a kit. Most of that is the analyzer so you amortize that.

I said "easy" not "fun". Big difference.

Alas, the trick is what to do with the data not the collection of said data.

I worked in a pretty good Athlete Performance Lab. Our protocol for determining running LT was based off of 10K time. I learned that for a large chunk of subjects a pace of 10-15 sec/mile slower than 10K race pace was a very good proxy for LT (at least how that lab chose the "break point").

1) I'm not selling sh!t. When I want to know what my LT is I go to the phys lab and get tested-free of charge. I was referring to accurately finding LT and not necessarily with this product. Never heard of the protocol used for this or know the accuracy of finding LT that way. Getting tested in the lab is a lot more accurate than basing it off some race pace. It's a simple reduction of variables. Now, if you could get real-time feedback on LT during LT-based workouts (which this product does not do), then that would be the ultimate.2) Unless Canova is your coach (trust me, he's not with your 1:10 half lol), he's not making up your workout paces and is irrelevant to this discussion.3) Yes. This thing "seems a heck of a lot cheaper and easier than buying a threshold monitor and also a lot more accurate than running off of feel."...if it works as described in the OP.The 21st Century says 'Hello.' Why don't you come join us.

You're an a$$.