Sensible (heel-less) training shoes?

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21 years ago 12/15/2002 9:27am EST

Does anyone know what training shoes have the least net heel lift (i.e, heel lift in relation to forefoot thickness)? Is there a training shoe that has NO net heel left?

The reason I ask is that I've been experimenting with training in my racing flats lately to see how a more flexible sole and little heel lift affects my achilles tendonitis. I'm happy with the results so far. The lack of heel lift seems to force me into more of a forefoot plant, so I no longer feel like I'm pounding. And I seem to be naturally running more upright. The achilles are much less sore toward the end of long runs than they were before -- even without my orthotic, which I'm trying to do without.

But I can see how I'd go through racing flats pretty quickly at this rate. So it would be nice to find a good training shoe with little or no heel lift. Or maybe I should just invest in a case of Shoe Goo?

21 years ago 12/31/2002 9:37am EST

re: drewp

Ya, I know what you mean. I've been doing lots of research about this matter recently and have found some startling information. I few things to check out first, look up Gordon Pirie's book that is published online in pdf format. It has some great info. Ive been doing some reasearch and found that all of the great runners train in flats. Look at Sebastian Coe, Jim Ryan, Peter Snell, they all trained in the old heel-less shoes. I havent found any training flats that fit the description. I would really invest in shoe goo and just periodically coat the soles of the shoes around the forefoot area.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 11:21am EST

re: drewp

Some of the Asics trainers (DS Trainer and Gel Verdict) have a very low, almost racing-flastesque feel to them. Give one of those a try, I've worn them for awhile.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 12:24pm EST

re: drewp

adidas trainers have a reputation of having the lowest heel heights (compared to thickness of forefoot foam) among running shoes - not sure if that is still the case or if it is then it is necessarily the case with all of the models in their current production line. the supernova classic would be one to check.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 12:35pm EST

re: J.R. Johsnon

21 years ago 12/31/2002 12:43pm EST

re: J.R. Johsnon

Not totally true...I have the documentary on SebCoe and he did at least some of his slower (slower, yeah right) distance stuff in the Nike Pegasus in the early/mid eighties--not exactly a "heel-less" shoe. I understand what Pirie, etc. are saying, and I believe it to be true--IF you have awesome mechanics, IF you have a totally healthy achilles, and IF you are a lightweight. Compared to the rest of the population (i.e., posters on a site like Runner's World), the people on this board are elite runners--but I doubt even people on here, as a group, could train in minimal shoes for 80 to 140 miles a week and live to tell about it. Do we all need Kayano's, Grid Stabils, and Nike Shox? Probably not. But the other extreme (a waffle racer, or a DS racer) would be at least as bad for most of us, if not worse.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 1:50pm EST

re: skylon

i have first-hand knowledge of someone who used to train in nothing but stability shoes (like air span, a6 gt 2k series, kayano, ds trainer) and made the switch to mainly streamlined light shoes (like air presto, fila flow/aeroflow) without a problem. yes, an experiment of one and an anecdotal example, but nonetheless true.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 2:15pm EST

re: drewp

Try the New Balance 831 or 730. The lift is low so you are on your toes quick.

21 years ago 12/31/2002 3:45pm EST

re: fatoldguy

New Balance 300 series (303,322,etc.) are very basic, good stability and cushioning with minimal or no heel lift. I get 'em for $ 40 at the local chain on sale and get tons of miles on them (up to 100+/week). Wearing these keeps me farther up on my feet, esp. on dirt- and no injuries. More expensive shoes have way to many gimmicks that break down fast and push you back on your heels, and eventually into the Dr.'s waiting room.

21 years ago 01/01/2003 2:11am EST

re: Heel Liberation

this is a very good point that is brougt up, i do believe that most shoes are over-built and have far too high of a heel lift. I too was brought up training in cushy shoes like the nike air max and the asics nimbus. After years of injuries i too have switched to more neutral lightweight trainers. I am on my fourth pair of Nike air Skylons. THese shoes are incredible, the one piece midsole outsole material is very resilient. I have found that i can get about 800 miles on each pair before feeling that the shoes have started to give out. This is about twice as many miles as i would get out of my heavier more cushioned shoes. Just my experience.

As for the original question some shoes with lowered heels here you go,

Nike -Skylon,katana trainer

Adidas- Rotterdam, response comp, supernova comp (outin jan 03),

Saucony - Grid Azura

Asics- verict, ds trainer/ racer

Mizuno- wave precision

Fila- Flow

21 years ago 01/01/2003 12:32pm EST

re: lou dog

Just for the record, all Mizuno shoes including the Precision have a 12mm differential between the forefoot and heel. The Precision heel and forefoot are 23 and 11, respectively.

I'll add Brooks Burn to the list. Although they also have a 12mm differential (as do almost all shoes other than racing flats), because they have a softer lateral heel and pretty firm cushioning in the forefoot (although not super-firm like DS-Trainers or Mavericks), they get you on your toes pretty well. I am interested in trying the Supernova Comps., which I get in the next few days.

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