Trying to Q for Boston on my first marathon. Help?

If you aren't a troll, use the search engine. There are lots of decent schedules to follow.

That said, for a first timer, I always recommend increasing the distance of the long run (including mp for the last 6-7 mi). 50 mpw may be too light. A second workout that incorportates mile repeats at specific distance pace (5-8 x1 mi at 1/2 mp). Lastly, a great last workout is 3 x5k @ mp.

Your race times shows a pretty rough worsening of ability as the distances get longer:

17 min 5k is equal to about a 2:45 marathon

37 min 10k is equal to about a 2:53 marathon

1:05 10 mile is equal to about a 3:02 marathon

Someone who runs a 17 min 5k should be able to run a 1:05 10 miler as a long tempo. The fact that it's race effort for you shows the obvious - you need to work on long runs and increased overall mileage. I would also place some emphasis on medium length runs of about 90 minutes that are "progression" type runs in which you start slow and gradually speed up, ending at almost race effort. You need to learn to run fairly fast while tired.

Enter a couple half marathons in the next couple months - that will help as well. You have enough time.

i was gonna say the same thing. I run 5k's at right around 17 but ive run a 10 miler in 57:02.

1:05 would be slower than a tempo effort, really.

I'd say 3:10 is definately too conservative given your 5k. I know when i do a full marathon (have run a half in about 1:18) i want to shoot for 2:45-2:50 range.

And i second the progression run idea. I love running 8-12 mile progression runs where start relaxed and finish up the last couple miles at about 10k or 1/2 marathon race pace depending on how i feel that day.

another 17min 5ker wrote:

I'd say 3:10 is definately too conservative given your 5k

Why is the word "definitely" such a challenge for LetsRun posters to spell correctly?

40 minutes is the threshold for 3:10 and you've broken that with ease. I suspect your lack of equivalent times at the longer distances vs. your 5k time is due simply to your recently increasing your distance goals.

Just work on the long runs and endurance. Lot's of LSD will get you there.

Get up to 70 MPW and hold it there for as long as you can while you build up your long run distances to 22-24 miles (or 3 hours duration).

You can easily run 3:10 IF you put in the miles.

thanks guys, i really appreciate the feedback. i like the idea of repeat 5k runs at MP. and increasing the mileage sounds good.

When I BQ'd (3:06 NY) for my first marathon my PRs going into the marathon were 20:13 5k, 41:28 10k, 1:29:05 HM were way slower than yours. I did Daniels' A-plan from his 2nd edition book. I think my max week was 67miles and averaged about 50 for the 18 weeks prior to NY in 06....

He has a lot of VO2Max is the first 6 weeks. Then a lot of tempo, MP work later on. He has three long MP runs (12-15 miles), plus a lot of tempo repeats.

My 10k was run 6-7 weeks before the marathon. I'm sure if I ran a 5k/10k/HM on the day of the marathon I would have shattered the above PR's (I went through the half in 1:29:49).

So I think you just need the distance. I wish I could run a 17 min 5k (or even a 19 min 5k :) )

Good luck. Let us know how you do in Dec.

Wow, I just wanted to say that it was really nice to see a thread where everyone was actually really supportive and helpful.

I second that.

aggie2012

A few months ago I ran 3:10 high.

My other PR times are: 5k 19:57, 10k 41:30, 10 mile 69:xx, 1/2 marathon 1:32 (the 1/2 was 6 weeks before the 3:10).

1st marathon was 2 years ago in 3:21 (same course as 3:10) then I ran 3:16, 3:15, 3:14, 3:10. BQ for me is 3:30.

I just follow Daniels' Plan A in his 2nd edition book. Best $$ I've spent towards running. I use 70-80 miles for my peak mileage weeks.

use the search function to find the thread "5 key marathon workouts". it gives some pretty good advice, even for someone with your goals. i would think that with some mileage work and long tempo runs you can get below 3:00 easily.

I ran my first marathon last fall with a peak in training of 51 miles. I started running 2.5 years ago and when I started training for the marathon I had a 5K PR of 19:05 and 10K of 39:23.

I used the <55, 24 week plan from Advanced Marathoning (I know, not intended for first timers). I ran 3:06 with a 3 minute porta potty break at mile 15.

My point...if you stick to a plan and get in the miles, you'll BQ, no doubt in my mind. With 19 weeks to go and a base of 50 miles, I'd frankly expect you to be under 3 hours pretty easily unless the course is up the side of a mountain.

Run for a few more years. Base mileage of 50 mpw is pathetic. You don't "need some better workouts" you need better aerobic development.

i ran those exact same times for 5k/10k/10miles and ran sub 3 at white rock for my first marathon. given good weather and no screw ups, you should have no problem with 3:10.

yeah it's me.

Sub 6 minute miles for 10k means that 7:15 pace is practically standing still for this guy. He needs slow twitch endurance and fuel usage training, he's got plenty of aerobic development. Lots of long slow miles at 7:30 to 8 minutes will do it.

Base mileage of 50MPW is only pathetic if you expect to run your potential best off of it. This guy is shooting for a time way below his natural abilities, and so 50 MPW is fine so long as he builds up above 60 MPW for his first marathon.

I personally think that you need to drop mileage substanially. 50 mpw will absolutely break your body down if you continue to run that high of mileage. After dropping my mileage from 50mpw to 20mpw I went from a 3:05 marathon to a 2:38. Just run NO MORE than 3 miles per day very slowly at about 9-10 minute pace. You will be amazed at what happens. I know it may seem to contradict popular belief but it worked for me and the physiology proves it. At 10 minute pace you recieve incredible mitochondrial activity and use your V02 max to its potential, and by stopping the run after two miles your body will super-compensate. Best of luck and see you in Bean Town.

-Llort Bernstein

thanks for all the help guys. hell i might even go for sub 3 now. haha

aggie2012 wrote:

thanks for all the help guys. hell i might even go for sub 3 now. haha

Not so Ha Ha.

Actually they will accept 3:10:59 if you're male 18-34.

Why...in my day you had to do sub 2:50!

3:10:59 is 7:17 per mile pace

3:05:00 is 7:03 per mile pace

2:59:59 is 6:52 per mile pace

I'll be conservative and say you are in 3:06 shape.

Can you safely get your weekly mileage up to 70mpw by late October, early November?