Threshold Tempos

Training Advice/Discussion 5k/10k

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 7:25am EDT

Traditionally, tempo workouts are 5-7 mile runs @tempo pace or something similar. However, my goal is to train my threshold pace like a tempo pace. For example, I’m currently working on 6:00 min/mile pace. I can run it consecutively for about 5 miles if I really grind it out. If I run it at a tempo level effort, I can run it consecutively for around 3 miles because after that it switches to a race level struggle. The way I train this from threshold pace to tempo pace is by attempting a 5 mile threshold at that pace (but tempo effort) weekly. So far, this has taken me from only being able to run a 1200m of this to 3 miles of this in just 3 weeks, keeping in mind that these 3 miles also don’t feel hard! Im just wondering a couple things (i only need about 1 min to recover and 2-2.5 to fully recover). Since I’m planning to use this throughout the summer and speed up the pace once I actually hit 5 miles, will negatively impact my fall xc performance, perhaps preventing me from improving as much come fall? In addition, has anyone ever used this strategy?

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 7:35am EDT

re: ltmpofurun

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 7:37am EDT

re: ltmpofurun

You made this a lot more confusing than it had to be.

The workout you are describing are continuous threshold tempo runs. A great tool for training, with the recommendation generally being 30 min max for a single session, so the 5 @ 6:00 would be MAX. But doing them every week, not so great. Switch it up. Do cruise intervals. Longer continuous runs at marathon pace.

I think doing threshold tempos for the whole summer will burn you out mentally and physically. Keep the workouts varied so you can get different stimuli and work on building up different areas like your aerobic capacity (easy/long runs/marathon pace workouts), power (hill repeats), efficiency (mile repetition pace/strides). Be well rounded coming into fall XC, not just a threshold powerhouse.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 7:41am EDT

re: FelixSprock

FelixSprock wrote:
You made this a lot more confusing than it had to be.
The workout you are describing are continuous threshold tempo runs. A great tool for training, with the recommendation generally being 30 min max for a single session, so the 5 @ 6:00 would be MAX. But doing them every week, not so great. Switch it up. Do cruise intervals. Longer continuous runs at marathon pace.
I think doing threshold tempos for the whole summer will burn you out mentally and physically. Keep the workouts varied so you can get different stimuli and work on building up different areas like your aerobic capacity (easy/long runs/marathon pace workouts), power (hill repeats), efficiency (mile repetition pace/strides). Be well rounded coming into fall XC, not just a threshold powerhouse.

More complicated and more difficult than needed. Agree, 30 minutes max at threshold effort and not every week. Longer distances can be done at sub-threshold, which is between MP and threshold pace.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 7:41am EDT

re: ltmpofurun

For anyone wondering, this is why coaches exist.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 8:52am EDT

re: ltmpofurun

ltmpofurun wrote:
Traditionally, tempo workouts are 5-7 mile runs @tempo pace or something similar. However, my goal is to train my threshold pace like a tempo pace. For example, I’m currently working on 6:00 min/mile pace. I can run it consecutively for about 5 miles if I really grind it out. If I run it at a tempo level effort, I can run it consecutively for around 3 miles because after that it switches to a race level struggle. The way I train this from threshold pace to tempo pace is by attempting a 5 mile threshold at that pace (but tempo effort) weekly. So far, this has taken me from only being able to run a 1200m of this to 3 miles of this in just 3 weeks, keeping in mind that these 3 miles also don’t feel hard! Im just wondering a couple things (i only need about 1 min to recover and 2-2.5 to fully recover). Since I’m planning to use this throughout the summer and speed up the pace once I actually hit 5 miles, will negatively impact my fall xc performance, perhaps preventing me from improving as much come fall? In addition, has anyone ever used this strategy?

Tempo pace is your aerobic threshold pace. For the trained runner, it is the pace they would run in a race of about an hour in length.

It sounds like you are doing these workouts faster than this pace. That is ok. I do not believe this workout will negatively impact xc, unless you do it too frequently. I'd do this workout no more than like 2 times in 3 weeks right now supplementing it with workouts that are not so close to a race effort.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 9:17am EDT

re: Kvothe

Ok great! I’ve been basically doing this workout once a week with 40-45 extra miles of 7:30-11:00 min/mile effort the rest of the time.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 9:19am EDT

re: prime example

You say that but if your coach gives you no instruction for the summer, how can you be faulted for making up your own plan? My coach used to run 1000 miles each summer when he was a kid.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 11:09pm EDT

re: ltmpofurun

I like to work up to the 30 min threshold tempo run by at first splitting it up into shorter intervals (aka cruise intervals or threshold reps). As an example, break it down into something like 6x5 minutes w/1 min rest until you are hitting every rep comfortably at 6:00 pace. Once you have that mastered I would then put it all together by doing the 30 min continuous. Trying to hammer the whole 30 minutes starting out could be a recipe for getting burned out or injured. Not revolutionary I realize but that would be my suggestion.

4 weeks ago 06/14/2024 11:11pm EDT

re: triplethreshold

Yeah I basically do that. My goal is to run until it feels like I’m exerting more than a threshold level effort. Once that is reached, I simply rest for 1:30 (same time as a 400m at this pace) and continue running and resting until I have run 5 miles.

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