The men's 5000 finish at the Ivy championships yesterday was similar to the 2021 US Olympic Trials in that the guy who crossed the finish line first - finished in lane 4. The big difference was that Columbia's Talha Syed was DQd, whereas Paul Chelimo was not.
Both clean. Syed was a stride ahead of bendsten the entire time. Watching the ESPN+ replay you can see bendsten’s hand on Syed’s back as he finishes. ivy league coaches letting politics get the best of them and playing dirty as usual
In both cases the drift out to lane 4 the reason wasn't the reason they maintained their leads. Chelimo and the Columbia kid both had more gas in the tank. I didn't see any contact, and the guys in 2nd didn't have to cut their strides. Play on.
Both are clean. If the Princeton runner had enough to beat him he would have. Columbia guy never made contact, and simply ran the faster race. A real shame they DQ'd him.
Bendtson didn't have to cut his stride at all. Syed simply veered out, he did not by any means force Bendtson outside. Syed was a full body length ahead as he approached the home stretch, yet Bendtson made the decision to come on the outside. It's simply just racing. Pretty silly to not let them race.
DQ. Should have been for Chelimo and rightfully so at the Ivy's
USATF Rule 163.3: Each competitor shall run in a direct line after entering the final straightaway in all races of two of more turns unless there is another competitor in his/ her path
Disqualified an athlete in a D2 Conference Championship a couple years ago for doing the exact the same thing
By the letter of the law, both are DQs. I was thrilled Chelimo wasn't DQd, however as i 1) I don't think he'd have been passed (where I do think the Columbia runner would have been passed) and 2) It was a qualifying race for the Olympics and clearly he was worthy of a top 3 finish. He also went on to win a medal at the Olympics.
In general, I think the we need somewhat contradictory things to happen.
1) If I was the head of WA, I'd issue a proclamation. If you come off the turn in lane 1 in the lead and leave lane 1, you will be DQd. Period. Then we don't have to worry about this moving forward.
2) We need something other than a total DQ. I'd like to see the Columbia runner placed 2nd and maybe Chelimo placed third.
PS. Jonathan gault thinks the opposite. He thinks Chelimo would have been passed but not the Columbia guy. I don't get how anyone thinks that. What the Columbia guy did was WAY more blatant than what Chelimo did. Chelimo's move out to lane 4 took almost 10 seconds and he ended up pulling away at the end. Remember, the Columbia guy is doing it on an indoor track. It happens in the span of four seconds from lane 1 to lane 4 and contact is made at the finish.
This post was edited 41 minutes after it was posted.
To be fair, the proclamation is already there as noted by the rule stated.
I won't disagree with either of your PS statements (Chelimo likely finishes third, contact at the end of Ivy race is more blatant) however rules interpretations can't have assumptions. We can't assume what would happen if the rules were followed.
Also, maybe the reason Chelimo pulled away at the end is because Chelimo forced his competitors to run 3 extra meters coming down the front straightaway (each lane is 42" wide over three lanes totals 100"+ of total distance) and they fatigued and/ or gave up. Doesn't sound like much distance but clearly played an important role in the race's outcome.
By the letter of the law, both are DQs. I was thrilled Chelimo wasn't DQd, however as i 1) I don't think he'd have been passed (where I do think the Columbia runner would have been passed) and 2) It was a qualifying race for the Olympics and clearly he was worthy of a top 3 finish. He also went on to win a medal at the Olympics.
In general, I think the we need somewhat contradictory things to happen.
1) If I was the head of WA, I'd issue a proclamation. If you come off the turn in lane 1 in the lead and leave lane 1, you will be DQd. Period. Then we don't have to worry about this moving forward.
2) We need something other than a total DQ. I'd like to see the Columbia runner placed 2nd and maybe Chelimo placed third.
PS. Jonathan gault thinks the opposite. He thinks Chelimo would have been passed but not the Columbia guy. I don't get how anyone thinks that. What the Columbia guy did was WAY more blatant than what Chelimo did. Chelimo's move out to lane 4 took almost 10 seconds and he ended up pulling away at the end. Remember, the Columbia guy is doing it on an indoor track. It happens in the span of four seconds from lane 1 to lane 4 and contact is made at the finish.
To be honest Rojo, I said that having watched the Heps video a few times but not watching the Chelimo footage recently. Having watched both, I am reversing course: I think Bendtsen was more likely to pass Syed than Kincaid or Fisher was to pass Chelimo. I do think in both cases that the trailing runner(s) would not have passed the leader had the leader just run a straight line. But even if you don't step in and blatantly cut someone off (which didn't happen in either case), you are asking for trouble if you are drifting out to lane 4 in the home stretch with someone on your shoulder...
This post was edited 4 minutes after it was posted.
2) We need something other than a total DQ. I'd like to see the Columbia runner placed 2nd and maybe Chelimo placed third.
I've always thought it was crazy that track only has one penalty--DQ. There are lots of other ways to think about penalties for minor or inadvertent violations. If Lord Coe can consider foul-less long jumping, how about considering these?
Drift to Lane 4: officials switch the order of finish. In this case, Princeton wins, Columbia 2nd in NT. Could do the same for inadvertent contact where nobody goes down.
Lane violations: some kind of time penalty. 0.1 sec per step on the line? Result is not record eligible, like a wind-aided time.
False start: move blocks back some distance. 1 meter? 2 meters?
2) We need something other than a total DQ. I'd like to see the Columbia runner placed 2nd and maybe Chelimo placed third.
I've always thought it was crazy that track only has one penalty--DQ. There are lots of other ways to think about penalties for minor or inadvertent violations. If Lord Coe can consider foul-less long jumping, how about considering these?
Drift to Lane 4: officials switch the order of finish. In this case, Princeton wins, Columbia 2nd in NT. Could do the same for inadvertent contact where nobody goes down.
Lane violations: some kind of time penalty. 0.1 sec per step on the line? Result is not record eligible, like a wind-aided time.
False start: move blocks back some distance. 1 meter? 2 meters?
You make some good points. I never thought it like this before but it's basically - death penalty or no penalty. It's crazy those are the only two options.
I've long said they should move false starts back 3 meters in case a Bolt false starts in a semi.
Good DQ. I love the fans who put their hands up like “wtf”.
On an unrelated noted, I just got home from watching a different conference meet, and it’s amazing how little the average track fan knows about the rules. Most are just clueless parents. In a 400 heat, a runner was trying to get to lane one off the break when he obviously didn’t have a step on the inside runner. Instead of getting cut off, the insider runner did what he should have done, and shoved the other runner out of his way. Around me in the stands, all of the clueless parents were upset that a runner got shoved, completely clueless as to the context.
The Columbia guy is wonderfully blatant. It reminds me of Angel Cordero on Codex vs Genuine Risk in the 1980 Preakness. Cordero later admitted he knew the filly would quit if he pushed her wide and hit her on the nose with his whip.