4x800, 5min rest: mile or 2 mile pace

In my opinion:

Mile pace is too hard to do 4x800 at, especially for high schoolers who are younger, and less aerobically developed.

If you are just starting outdoor season, it is also probably too early to do something like this as you will definitely go lactic early, and spend a lot of time lactic.

2 mile pace would definitely be better for this especially at this time of year. However as the season goes on, this workout should get either longer (more reps) or you get less recovery.

It is better to do a workout that is too easy than one that is too hard. Obviously you need hard workouts too, but you shouldn’t be going that deep into the well this early.

Either or, run these at current fitness, not goal pace.

My recommendation if you're allowed to adjust at all: 3 x 800 @ mile w./ 3:00-4:00 rest or 4-5 x 800 @ 3k w./ 2:00-2:30 rest.

5:00 rest is too much for 2 mile pace but 4 reps is one too many for mile work imo. Something's gotta give.

4 x 800 at 1600 pace with 5 minutes break is a great workout but I wouldn't encourage that workout unless you have been building up to that workout over the course of several other workouts.

5 minute breaks are too long for 3200 pace. Probably 5 to 6 x 800 at 3200 pace with 2 to 3 minute breaks.

For what it's worth, I once tried 3x800 at mile pace, 4 mins rest. Total gutbuster, last rep fell apart, probably counterproductive. But then again I suck.

Assuming you have been working up to this workout I would do it at mile date pace to start and not goal pace. If you are feeling good you can start out at date pace and work down to goal pace. So say your PR is 5:00 you could go 2:30, 2:28, 2:26, 2:25 or something like that. I would assume if your at this workout now then your close to tapering for the end of the indoor season? Mentally 800s are pretty hard for high school kids and some college. So if I do have an athlete do it I usually will just do one 800 then drop to 600s then 400s then 300s in a workout. So may go 800-2x600-2x400-2x300 with 3min rest starting at close to date pace with the goal of maybe 1 sec faster as you step down.

800s @ 2 mile pace with shorter rest will be more beneficial if you are early in your season. We recently did 2 x (3 x 800) with 90 sec rest and lap walk/jog between sets. Challenging but not a killer.

Inb4 runningart2004 chimes in saying that 4x800 with 2 minute rest = mile pace because he did 4 x 800 at 2:10 and ran 4:25 or some nonsense

Citius that workout is impossible for a 5:00 miler unless you are the most insane workout warrior imaginable. You can’t do 4 800s at mile pace in training and if you can you’re doing some seriously wrong in races. 3 x 800 at mile pace with long rest is the most challenging workout I have my athletes due and it is brutal.

This post pretty much aligns with how my brain works. Another option, keep the 4x8 with 5 rest, but do it at a pace between mile and 2 mile. Or start at 2 mile and try to cut down to mile pace by rep no. 4.

So if you are a 4:20/9:20 type of runner, it would look something like this:

2:20

2:17

2:14

2:10

Or maybe you aren't a strong workout runner and 2 mile pace on all 4 reps feels fast, even with 5 minutes rest. "Too much" rest is not going to be an issue, unless all of your workouts are like that. Hopefully, you are doing a lot of familiar workouts, where the rest intervals are dialed in.

What kind of effort are you trying to hit in this workout? Have you gone a while (at least a week) without a really hard workout? If so, I would start out slightly faster (2-4 seconds) than 2 mile pace, then work your way down to slightly-slow-to-slightly-faster than mile pace. Since you didn't give your PR's I can't really give you exact times to run, but aim to gradually, but steadily get faster throughout the workout. This plan should give you the effort you're looking for. If it was too easy, then you can always add on more reps (doesn't even have to be an 800) than prescribed until you feel like you couldn't hit another rep at pace.

If you have recently had some hard sessions and are giving yourself a break, then running them evenly around 2-mile should be fine, but I would cut the rest down to like 2 minutes.

Thanks guys, this is our first real workout (ie intervals), besides hills, progression runs, and strides. I will do it at projected (not goal) 2 mile pace as its the Thursday before our first invite, and I will only have 1 day recovery (personally I think the workout should be on wed but I don't control the coach).

Doing a workout Thursday for a Saturday race is literally completely reasonable especially when it’s this early and meets don’t matter as much, and you’re not going super hard on it. Toughen up a little

This is also a coach who's a teenager and told me to race workouts (last years third man)

Do it at 3200 goal pace and practice feeling relaxed. With that much rest, you should be fresh for each rep.

Run them slower. problem solved

run it at 2 mile pace. rest is a bit long (3' or even less would be better depending on how fast you are) but it's fine. 1 slightly easier workout won't make a big difference in your season, but overextending yourself in an early workout can ruin a week of training.

Which is wrong in so many HS settings. I saw a training session for elites - if they do 2 or 3 reps, then 4 has to be better right?!

As others have stated, 3 is plenty - I know of an Olympian who did 3 (5 minutes recovery) - and likely too much for an undeveloped HSer. If they are racing a fair amount, and many HS programs do, then this kind of race-specific rep prep isn't really necessary anyway, as that is what the races are for. Doing other elements (speed, Threshold, and VO2max 3k-5k Intervals) balance out the races, especially if they have a limited event range (like 800/1600 or 1600/3200).

Just a thought - not every workout has to be at some specific race distance/pace combination. You're allowed to run reps at a pace that is in between.

In this case, slower than mile pace, yet still faster than 2-mile pace seems to make complete sense.

800's at 2-mile pace are a classic in the VO2 vein, and as others have noted, 5 minutes seems like too much rest to optimize the workout (with too much rest before each rep, it takes awhile to get up to the proper heart rate within each rep, so you're not spending as much time at the right intensity to get the stimulus you want in order to improve).

800's at mile pace seems like a later-season, race specific workout. When you're doing reps for half the distance you could race at that pace, those reps are going to feel very intense. For example, if you run 1k reps at 5k pace, each rep is 1/5th the distance you could race at that pace. 400's at mile pace represent 1/4th the distance you could race at that pace, and so on. 1/2 is a pretty high ratio, and is often used in race-simulation style workouts, so 4 reps (totaling double race distance) seems like a bit much.

TL/DR: Given the number of reps and the amount of rest, a pace that is in between 2-mile and 1-mile race pace seems most appropriate (given the early season nature of the workout, I would err closer to 2-mile pace).

My guess is that your coach means for this to be a 3200-pace rhythm workout and gave long rest to allow blood lactate to drop and keep it from being too hard. That's reasonable, but I'd assign shorter intervals for that purpose.

Late in the season (like 2 weeks out from a goal race), I'd assign 3x800 @ 1600 w/ 4-5 min rest. I'd only assign 4x800 to a high school senior with a relatively high training age (for example, someone who has been training fairly hard since freshman year). In either case, I'd want the runner to have some 600s and 400s at mile pace before they get into 800s.