Why do people PR a lot, when training for a longer race?

I'm not sure how much of this I understand but to your thread title, if you're training for a long race you're probably running a lot, at least by your own standards, so you're fitter. That's why you'd get a PR. No, your taper isn't going to cost you significant fitness. You can race well for weeks, at least, if you're really fit. When you race doesn't matter once you're at peak fitness. And I'd imagine the reason you rarely see someone focused on a 5k get a 10k PR (I have no idea if this really happens but let's say it does) is because people focused on 5k aren't running enough to do well at 10k.

Why in hell would you taper two weeks for a half marathon?

The tapper shouldn't hinder it.

People tend to run a P.R., USA when they trane for linger razes because they finally are working on aerobic development. You've gotta let some air in. Previously they spent all that time running to fast and this is the first time they learned to Slow It Down® and actually work on that. I've bean telling people for years that they need to Slow It Down® it is what helped me get to the trials and pace Deena Kastor to an American record which was the highlighter of my carier.

So Slow It Down®

I’m not trying to be funny with this question as I really don’t understand how long you should taper for, but malmo, it’s my understanding if I want to lay it all on the line for a PR in the half marathon my last three weeks may look like this:

80 miles

65 miles

50 miles( race at end of week)

so I would consider that a two week taper. I could go so far to say it would be a 10 day taper looking at the way the weeks are set up mileage wise…. But what is it you are saying about a two week taper is crazy? Honestly, like I said not trying to be funny or an idiot just maybe I have the wrong idea.

I think it was the 1991 Philadelphia distance run where I went 1:04 change. I couldn't believe the 10K split. I'll look it up tomorrow.

Could have been 1990. I'm trying to find the results.

I don't think you're understanding correctly at all. One week is plenty.

HM training:

(20) 103 miles Sept 4
S 8/29 PM 4 warmup, 10 x Chestnut Hill (69-71), 5 warmdown
M 8/30 AM 4 easy PM 11 slow
T 8/31 AM 4 easy PM 4 warmup, 8x800 (2:10) w/400jog, 4 easy
W 9/1 PM 13 moderate
T 9/2 AM 4 easy PM 4 warmup, 1 mile (4:16.1), 8x200 (27.7) w/ 200 jog, 4warmdown
F 9/3 AM 4 easy PM 12 easy
S 9/4 AM 4 easy PM 9 easy

(21) 128 miles Sept 11
S 9/5 AM 7 slow PM 4 slow
M 9/6 AM New Haven 20k, 3 warmup, 20k race in 59:42 (3rd), 4 warmdown
T 9/7 PM 15 easy
W 9/8 AM 10 easy PM 11 easy
T 9/9 AM 7 easy PM 4 warmup, 4 x1200(3:19, 3:16, 3:15, 3:09) very easy! w/ 400 jog, 4 warmdown
F 9/10 PM 22 easy
S 9/11 AM 9 easy PM 11 moderate

(22) 102 miles Sept 18
S 9/12 PM 3.5 warmup, 8 x heartbreak hill (1:36,1:35,1:35,1:35,1:35,1:35,1:37,1:36), 3.5 easy
M 9/13 AM 4.3 hard (21:14) PM 10 moderate (59:30)
T 9/14 AM 4 easy PM 12.5 moderate
W 9/15 AM 7 easy PM 4 warmup, 2 x 1mile (4:16.4, 4:15.8) w 2:30 jog, 4 warmdown
T 9/16 AM 8.5 moderate PM 12 easy
F 9/17 AM 4.5 easy PM 10.5 easy
S 9/18 PM 6 slow, very humid, can't breathe!

S 9/19 AM Philly Distance Run, 2.5 warmup, 13.1 race in 1:01:43(AR 2nd) Winner Mike Musioki 1:01:35(WR), 2.5 warmdown

Thanks and I do find that interesting as the mileage is

103

128

103 (race)

so had a “down week” 3 weeks out, back up again 2 weeks…

interesting… thanks for posting your knowledge… would be interesting if this would be advisable for the sub elite level or just elite level…. As maybe the pros have more pounding and experience than the sub elite…. Anyway, thanks again

Most people don’t do enough aerobic miles and work to run a proper mile/5k/10k, so half/full training can be a real game changer as long as you stay in touch with speed!

Ps not calling 103 miles a down week at all, per say…. Ha… would be 20 miles higher than my max all time … just down for you…

Training for a longer distance generally means more running, specifically, more aerobic running, which can sometimes get lost amid the shorter 5k plans (not to say people aren't doing them, just not in as great a proportion).

When training for 5 and 10k, people tend to focus on Vo2 Max workouts and Lactate Threshold, which are fine, but they're just the icing on the cake. Real improvement, in distances beyond the mile, comes from developing your aerobic base. Remember, metabolically, a 5k is still more than 90% aerobic.

Another aspect, and this may just be anecdotal; I've found that after training for a longer event, shorter events are psychologically a lot easier. The distance seems much more manageable, and I feel far more in control e.g. If I tell myself, I've only got to endure 5 more minutes of pain, it doesn't seem so bad after doing much longer reps in training.

When going up a distance, I find the longer events so much more difficult, as all of my hard training going in has consisted of shorter reps, which are intense, but I haven't suffered for a long period of time.

That "down" week precedes a 20k race. To answer your question, no you shouldn't try to duplicate a pro running schedule. Learn from it, apply general concepts to your situation. A highly trained athlete's OBLA curve is going to look different than yours. And Bekele's OBLA curve is going to look flatter and bend further to the right than mine. A highly trained runner is going to be able to maintain a higher velocity for longer periods. He feels like he's flying because he is almost literally flying.

Lydiard noticed this phenomenon 50 years ago. That's what led to the idea of base training. Anything 800 and above is mostly aerobic and the aerobic training is where you can see the most improvement.

it would be interesting to see your buildup to that race as it’s quite different than what I would have imagined. and not to beat a dead horse, but did you find out the hard way that you didn’t need to taper much for a half ? Meaning you tried it before and it didn’t work out… Goes somewhat with what I was rambling about in my first post…. Some guys PR in the build up of half or marathon in the 10k and half…. Then taper for their goal race and run lousy… I remember tapering in college for a 10k cross… I’ve been in the mindset taper like hell ( keep quality up, mileage down about 30% the week of the race from highest week)….I guess I’ll have to read up on these tapers as I love the extra info… as I obviously don’t have a clue!! Thanks again for your post…

This post needs 10x more upvotes than it currently has.

HRE is, as usual, correct. You've built your aerobic engine well, and that should last you quite a while. If you are someone who is more naturally 'fast' like me (you actually enjoy track workouts and under normal circumstances over-perform at 5K relative to longer distances), you might well need some sharpening up before you can attack shorter distances, especially if you have eschewed speed work in your buildup. But that aerobic base will serve you very well.

For the question in the thread title, the basic answer is a lack of specificity in the training for the longer race. If you're running PRs in 5k-10k while building up for a marathon, that's a sign of trouble for marathon race day because you won't be ready for the specific demands of the marathon.

For the initial post, I think it depends on how you absorb the training and when your body is ready to capitalize on all of that training. There are too many variables in play to say why and when someone is ready to perform.

For pros, 10k and half marathon training are similar in terms of physiology. For amateurs, it can be very different depending on how long it take you to complete the race distance. The training should reflect that.

It was my first HM, and I didn't even know I was running it until Thursday before the race. I post the full buildup when I get a chance.