Yann Schrub, 27:49.64/10,000, French cc champion, only trains once a day, 5-6 times per week

I think that at the base of the idea of single sessions and low mileage there is a big misunderstanding. Nobody says not possible to achieve very good results with low mileage and only 5-6 sessions per week. For instance, I had one athlete (Roberto Crosio) working 8 hours per day in DHL (so training only once per day) who started as amateur with a value of about 33' in 10 km in his first year of activity (when 21 years old), and when was 28 won Carpi Marathon in 2:12'04", and next year was number 7 in the World Marathon Cup in Athens that Italy won (Milesi 3rd, Gozzano 5th and Crosio 7th) with all athletes directly followed by myself.

The fact is that those athletes, normally not fully professional because have some job requiring several hours per day of business committmens, use a big percentage of their energy for their job, and training twice per day don't have the possibility to recover.

If they can find the opportunity to become fully professional, using all their time for running, they can recover their training in better way, and this can allow them to increase mileage and intensity (in other words, the quality of their training), producing much better performances.

One session per day is a correct way for reaching the best personal performances ONLY when there is some other professional activity requiring time and efforts every day. So, we can say that is the right phylosophy for amateurs. However, if a professional athlete wants to achieve his best possible results, IN EVERY SPORT needs to train twice per day, in order to increase the volume of his basic preparation, that is the reason because, later, it's possible to raise the level of intensity.

In the case of Schrub, the real question is : WHICH PERFORMANCES CAN YANN ACHIEVE WITH HIS TALENT, IF CAN HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DEDICATE AT TRAINING ONLY (without any other job) THE NEXT 2-3 YEARS ? And probably the answer is 30"/40" faster in 10,000m, and a marathon under 2:10.

Medical students are on their feet all day walking several miles. That's stress on their bodies people don't really think about as far as training is concerned. Me personally, even though I don't run as much with my current job(on my feet all day walking several miles). I'm still running PBs, probably because when you include the mileage from walking I'm covering similar mileage as before.

+1 - The French runners currently sub 28 minutes/10,000, or close:

1. Amdouni 27:23.39 (full-time professional runner)

2.Schrub 27:49.64 (8th year medical student) trains 5/6 times per week, 1 hour per day average

3. Bour 27:51.22 (full-time professional runner)

4. Carvalho 27:55.68 (Policeman, but detached for training)

5. Mehdi Frère 28:03.90 (National Guard Policeman, detached for training)

12. Roudolff Levissse 28:37.23 (full-time professional runner)

16. J.Wanders 28:55.29 (full-time professional runner)

Interestingly, Wanders is included in the French Federation list because he has a license in a French club and the French consider him to be French. Wanders is a dual national but runs for Switzerland.

In the link, attached, is the list of the best French times in 2021 for the 10,000 m. It would be interesting to compare these lists with the best times in Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany and GB (and any other nation) for 2021. Anyone wishing to do that (or their own national list ) please post here with many thanks in advance.

So he trains like a US HS boy and runs US HS boy times? Got it.

Except no high school boy has run 27:49

Renato Canova wrote:

I think that at the base of the idea of single sessions and low mileage there is a big misunderstanding. Nobody says not possible to achieve very good results with low mileage and only 5-6 sessions per week.(...).

Great answer from a coaching legend. Thank you for taking your time.

So how much mileage does he do? What does his training look like?

lol walking around all day does not turn someone into a fast runner.

I think many readers would discount Amdouni from a list of bona fide athlete performers

with magic optimal DANCAN 27:20 and Olympics would be coming!

[quote]cramberrys wrote:

with magic optimal DANCAN 27:20 and Olympics would be coming![/quote

Many people discount the DANCAN method but this eighth year medical student and outstanding athlete, and sub 28 minute/10,000 performer, Yann Schrub, recent winner of the French national long course cross country (12km) championships, has shown that a modified DANCAN system has actually worked well for him. That is, assuming that he incorporates aspects of the DANCAN system into his training, which is plausible.

If the Swedish guru is reading this, he might presently be rubbing his hands in glee at the success of the eighth year medical student and doctor, Yann Schrub. A vindication of sorts you might consider, for the maverick Swede.

By the way, mavericks should not necessarily be looked at in a negative light because they are often innovators and leaders in their own way.

The input from R.Canova, was very well received and appreciated, and reminiscent of a previous post he had posted I think about the same athlete, or a similar athletes who ended up running two hours 11 minutes with once a day training. If I remember rightly, this runner with a tiny stature, barely topping 5 feet tall/1.60 cm.

If I’m getting the two confused, I stand corrected with apologies.

TeteDLO wrote:

I think many readers would discount Amdouni from a list of bona fide athlete performers

Amdouni: Yes he was involved in some controversy a couple of years ago with regard to possible involvement with illicit products but that was resolved to the satisfaction of the French track and field Association. This past summer, in the Olympic marathon, he did not help his case with his « road rage » incident in which he slammed many water bottles of his peers and rivals in frustration with his performance during the closing stages of the marathon. It was assumed after the race that he was in an “altered state” which rendered his rationality somewhat null and void at the time.

For the past few months however, (M.A.) he has not put a foot wrong, losing several times to many of the French national athletes but losing graciously and accepting defeat without any untoward words towards his principal French rivals including Felix Bour, and yesterday - Yann Schrub.

If we look at the background where this athlete, Morhad Amdouni, came from, in the low cost housing projects and crime ridden neighborhood of Porto-Vecchio, Corsica, we can perhaps better understand his personality and social cultural mores and values. Many of his childhood peers are now sitting in prisons not only in Corsica but also in the mainland, so credit to him for leading a clean and productive life.

We should look at the big picture. Thank you.

weretyjhrge wrote:

So how much mileage does he do? What does his training look like?

It says he's averaging an hour on his five or six running days so you'd think his weekly mileage would be in the 50-60 mile range.

that's pretty impressive on low training mileage. That's what you call talent right there. 99% of us could run full time, train 120 MPW and not even approach breaking 30:00 for a 10K

Bernard Lagat trained (trains?) once a day, six days a week

Lagat’s training routine, like Meb’s, seems to involve a relaxed attitude and a lot of rest. Lagat skips a day of running every week, and he takes a month off every fall. At most, he runs about sixty-five miles a week, which is roughly half as many as his most obsessive rivals. He’s not lazy—he does everything hard. He also never seems to get hurt.

-New Yorker magazine

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444032404578006274010745406.html

-WSJ

From 3min26 1500m to 2h12 marathon

What to make of that?

HRE wrote:

weretyjhrge wrote:

So how much mileage does he do? What does his training look like?

It says he's averaging an hour on his five or six running days so you'd think his weekly mileage would be in the 50-60 mile range.

where does "it" say that? at no stage in that interview did he say that he averages an hour per session. There's nothing in his progression or his times at a younger age that suggest a level of talent that's out of the oridnary so I'd suggest it's likely he's getting in 6 sessions minimum a week and probably getting a minimum of 75-80 miles out of that.

As he says himself, he has to prioritise quality over quantity currently and also acknowledges that to make the step up to genuine world class he'd need to increase the volume of his training. Clearly a very intelligent bloke and I imagine that translates into how he trains

Jeff Albertson wrote:

So he trains like a US HS boy and runs US HS boy times? Got it.

Not. Even. Close.

All time HS 10,000m times:

28:32.7 Rudy Chapa (Hammond, Indiana) 1976

28:55.0 Eric Hulst (Laguna Beach, California) 1976

29:06.8 *Bill McChesney (South, Eugene, Oregon) 1976

29:09.4 ————Chapa 1976

29:09.56 Galen Rupp (Central Catholic, Portland, Oregon) 2004

29:11.0 ————*Chapa 1975

29:11.1 ————*Hulst 1975

29:17.6 Gerry Lindgren (Rogers, Spokane, Washington) 1964

29:27.2 ————**McChesney 1975

29:30.6 ————Hulst 1976

Ghost1 wrote:

In the link, attached, is the list of the best French times in 2021 for the 10,000 m. It would be interesting to compare these lists with the best times in Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany and GB (and any other nation) for 2021. Anyone wishing to do that (or their own national list ) please post here with many thanks in advance.

https://bases.athle.fr/asp.net/liste.aspx?frmpostback=true&frmbase=bilans&frmmode=1&frmespace=0&frmannee=2021&frmathlerama=&frmfcompetition=&frmfepreuve=&frmepreuve=260&frmplaces=&frmnationalite=&frmamini=&frmamaxi=&frmsexe=M&frmcategorie=&frmvent=

GB had 5 under 28 minutes this year

overall a very similar list with 15 under 29 minutes, as opposed to the 16 from France

How is he running a modified DANCAN system? There are tons of low mileage programs and tons of high mileage programs. You can't lump them all together. The number of days or mileage you run tells you NOTHING about the program.

As Renato stated, he's a med school student. His life outside of training is very mentally and physically demanding, so his running workload is much different than it appears.