Intervals instead of tempo runs?

Do some fartlek runs, hill reps and strides too. You got to do different training stimulus for best results rather than what you've been doing.

I've tried fartlek and strides, the problem is I don't have enough strengh / fitness to stay below 6:00 pace for long. If I did intervals I think I would be able to consistenly do them around 75-80 seconds which is faster than 6:00 pace.

4289107 wrote:

I've tried fartlek and strides, the problem is I don't have enough strengh / fitness to stay below 6:00 pace for long. If I did intervals I think I would be able to consistenly do them around 75-80 seconds which is faster than 6:00 pace.

Just do something like 10*1 minute with 1 minute recovery in the middle of your runs for example. You don't need a track to be fast. Is this considered fartlek or intervals? I think it's both.

You have answered your own question. You can continue to add more weekly mileage or you can start doing workouts. A runner does not need a track unless a runner plans on racing on a track. You can measure out 1/2 mile on the road &/or do 3 minute repeats on the road.

If you are running a lot in general at 7 minute pace, and your tempo runs can touch 6:50, you need a bigger gap there.

Either slow down your general running, or run some speedwork to increase the pace of your tempo runs. You seem to be in the pretty-hard-all-the-time rut, yet running harder is a chore.

Just wanted some opinions. I'll try it out and see what happens.

4289107 wrote:

Just wanted some opinions. I'll try it out and see what happens.

You don't need a track or fancy watch to do intervals. Either run them by time (2:00 min fast, 1:00 min jog, repeat; change time factor as desired). If you do have a GPS watch, you can easily program it to do intervals of any length you want, whether time or distance based.

Most people would advise not to drop tempos and do intervals instead, but to do both. They train different things. Both make you faster, in different ways.

4289107 wrote:

I've tried fartlek and strides, the problem is I don't have enough strengh / fitness to stay below 6:00 pace for long. If I did intervals I think I would be able to consistenly do them around 75-80 seconds which is faster than 6:00 pace.

I mean then that's your starting place. You're not gonna run faster than 6:00 pace with easy miles & tempos. You should keep the tempos in but move away from doing them weekly. You don't need a track to do speed work & it doesn't matter if you need short intervals. Start short. 8 x 1:00 on/1:00 off. Anything in the 1:00-5:00 range can be turned into a good speed workout on the roads. You could also play around with broken tempos so instead of 20:00 straight, you do 3 x 7:00-8:00 (2:00-3:00 jogs). That way you're able to increase the pace a little more than a straight tempo.

2 easy things you can start incorporating- 1) strides 2x/week- 6-10 x :20 fast, :40-1:00 slow. Do that on easy days. The day before your workouts and long runs. That's just gonna help with turnover & will add up over time. 2) do short reps after tempo workouts. If you're doing a 20:00 tempo, finish with 4-6 x :30 hard (:30-1:30 easy). That's just an easy way to spin the legs & hit on some speed.

when you are running your regular runs at 7:00 pace, that is basically a tempo, so you're not gonna get much extra benefit from what you call your tempo run.

yes, intervals will help.

I think somebody could stay reasonably close to race shape, all year long, by just doing one tempo run of various distances and one 400s or 800s workout, every week.

4289107 wrote:

I've been running for two years and have not performed intervals before. I never had access to a track. Instead I do a tempo run each week, ranging from 20 to 60 minutes and pace 6:30-6:50. All of my other runs are 7 or 8 minute miles on 40 miles per week. PBs are a 5k of 18:41 and 10k of 38:22.

I feel like I have never gained any speed or fitness from tempo runs. However, when I have done a 5k time trial (which for me is 6:00 to 6:05 pace) I feel faster for a few days. I'm starting to think that I only respond to threshold running or volume of running, and tempo runs are neither here nor there.

Can anyone offer imput on this? I'm thinking of dropping my tempo run for some 400m repeats on a quiet road.

You can do intervals at different efforts. Some people respond better to intervals below threshold effort and can exchange the tempo for that (2-10min reps with 1-2min rest). In addition you can do threshold or a little faster interval work to boost top speed. Intervals are proven to be very efficient training. Use the easy running to learn how to run economically for a long time.

Do both. Fast intervals on Tuesday, tempo on Thursday or Friday.

If you can't get to a track either find a straight section of road and use your watch - it will be fairly accurate on a straight road. Do either 10x300m or 10x400m to start and you can build up from there. I'd try and do recovery equal to the rep time. Or, just do one minute on/off, or 90 seconds on/off for 10 reps.

GettingFasterDude wrote:

4289107 wrote:

Just wanted some opinions. I'll try it out and see what happens.

You don't need a track or fancy watch to do intervals. Either run them by time (2:00 min fast, 1:00 min jog, repeat; change time factor as desired). If you do have a GPS watch, you can easily program it to do intervals of any length you want, whether time or distance based.

Most people would advise not to drop tempos and do intervals instead, but to do both. They train different things. Both make you faster, in different ways.

Exactly. Quality sessions 2-3x per week. Tempo, Interval, speedwork its all good. Jack Daniels likes 3 min as optimum interval work bout. Thats MUCH longer than I was given in HS. 400M doesnt even get you up to interval HR. Unless you monkey with the rest. But I think us amatuers take too long a rest for 400s to be considered intervals. But good for strength, leg turnover, and running faster.

4289107 wrote:

I've been running for two years and have not performed intervals before. I never had access to a track. Instead I do a tempo run each week, ranging from 20 to 60 minutes and pace 6:30-6:50. All of my other runs are 7 or 8 minute miles on 40 miles per week. PBs are a 5k of 18:41 and 10k of 38:22.

I feel like I have never gained any speed or fitness from tempo runs. However, when I have done a 5k time trial (which for me is 6:00 to 6:05 pace) I feel faster for a few days. I'm starting to think that I only respond to threshold running or volume of running, and tempo runs are neither here nor there.

Can anyone offer imput on this? I'm thinking of dropping my tempo run for some 400m repeats on a quiet road.

You say you have been running for 2 years at 40mpw. Improvement is going to come from continuing to train and maybe increasing your mileage. Just be patient. Adding tempos would be fine, but it's too early to consider serious interval training.

high school xc coach wrote:

when you are running your regular runs at 7:00 pace, that is basically a tempo, so you're not gonna get much extra benefit from what you call your tempo run.

yes, intervals will help.

I think somebody could stay reasonably close to race shape, all year long, by just doing one tempo run of various distances and one 400s or 800s workout, every week.

Frank Shorter ^

Interesting that you're not getting faster.

From my own experience in the last 18 months I've gotten quicker from 20 min 5k down to 16:30 min with mainly fast, short tempos almost daily.

I run about 20-25k per week.

Usually no more than 10/15 mins per day.

On the days I do a few intervals it's never more than 3 and always with full recovery.

I'm 42 now and the main thing I've found that the low mileage has left me with enough energy each day to go again the next day.

Lastly, I wear asics metaspeed every day and it's definitely true that the super-shoes help.

In a nutshell,

Consistency, training for short periods, and super-shoes are what's helping me.

Good luck!

high school xc coach wrote:

when you are running your regular runs at 7:00 pace, that is basically a tempo, so you're not gonna get much extra benefit from what you call your tempo run.

yes, intervals will help.

I think somebody could stay reasonably close to race shape, all year long, by just doing one tempo run of various distances and one 400s or 800s workout, every week.

Agreed, something like the Aussie complex system. A hilly fartlek or tempo with some hill reps one day a week, some Deek quarters or something else faster on the track. One good progression run once a week. And a long run.

4289107 wrote:

I've been running for two years and have not performed intervals before. I never had access to a track. Instead I do a tempo run each week, ranging from 20 to 60 minutes and pace 6:30-6:50. All of my other runs are 7 or 8 minute miles on 40 miles per week. PBs are a 5k of 18:41 and 10k of 38:22.

I feel like I have never gained any speed or fitness from tempo runs. However, when I have done a 5k time trial (which for me is 6:00 to 6:05 pace) I feel faster for a few days. I'm starting to think that I only respond to threshold running or volume of running, and tempo runs are neither here nor there.

Can anyone offer imput on this? I'm thinking of dropping my tempo run for some 400m repeats on a quiet road.

You should be doing both. And you can do them on the road, just use your watch dude. Also, is there no school around you with a track?

I assume you possibly were a junior high school T&F athlete, high school for sure. Didn't you do 1/2 mile repeats on grass by 2nd week of XC practice? Didn't you do 400m or 440yd repeats by 2nd week of practice, T&F?

Do variations of intervals for time to add up to 3 miles of speed, such as 6 x 3 min or 12 x 90 sec or 4 x 4:30.

Do it out and back on a flat fresh asphalt road. Then after a few months find a rolling course that mimics a race course.