Elliot Giles 1:43.63, 2nd all time!

I feel like Coevett will only be partially excited.

Fantastic news! Didn't expect that.

Middle-distance is completely stacked in the UK now.

coetarded wrote:

I feel like Coevett will only be partially excited.

Deano will be annoyed, but times move on.

What is giles? Looks weird.

What the hell? This guy's never made it out of a semifinal in an outdoor world championship.

Time for Rojo to bring up the spikes

weird and interesting wrote:

What the hell? This guy's never made it out of a semifinal in an outdoor world championship.

He did really well in a race the other day also. I was thinking “is that Giles up front.” Very unusual, indeed. But also congrats. Maybe something just clicked in his training.

Coevett wrote:

Fantastic news! Didn't expect that.

Middle-distance is completely stacked in the UK now.

same here in Australia with 800,1500,mile and two mile indoor records broken in last week. Something doesn't seem right.

coahc wrote:

Coevett wrote:

Fantastic news! Didn't expect that.

Middle-distance is completely stacked in the UK now.

same here in Australia with 800,1500,mile and two mile indoor records broken in last week. Something doesn't seem right.

we're in the golden age of running right now, enjoy it.

superb run

Number 2 all time

Blimey! Crack'in good running. Totally forgot to tune in today. Missed something special.

WOW! Impressive run. Watched the Dubai workout they did on YouTube they split a crazy 900m time & I knew he was fit! Going to be interesting to watch the half milers battle it out with Brazier.

SanDiegorunner wrote:

WOW! Impressive run. Watched the Dubai workout they did on YouTube they split a crazy 900m time & I knew he was fit! Going to be interesting to watch the half milers battle it out with Brazier.

Then lets get it started!

Brazier v. Giles

Who you got!

I don’t see anyone beating Brazier! He’s so strong and his 400m speed is faster than Giles (please prove me wrong if I am)

It should be interesting! Brazier once again has broken his indoor record, but it’s a little more than half a second slower than this run.

Brazier however, didn’t look all that tired. Did he look this way because he actually wasn’t tired, or was it because he has incredible form when tired. Maybe that’s the question to be answered.

Video of race.

Really good pacing, and Giles dug deep. Awesome stuff.

You know these results we are seeing of late (everything now from the 800 to the mile) are really interesting in terms of challenging the convention that simply "indoors is slower than outdoors".

The only negative impact of running indoors is the radius of the curves relative to the speed of running. Obviously rounding a tight bend of an indoor track at 10m/s is far more challenging than rounding a bend twice the radius at the same speed on an outdoor track - but the only variable there is the speed of running. At some point the effects of speed vs radius become irrelevant, especially when you offset the benefits of indoors (no wind, banked turns).

I mentioned this on the thread the other day from Lievin - a lot of pros like running 3000m indoors vs outdoors because the rhythm of 29-30s 200m pace indoors seems to be just about right - but maybe it's also pretty good for 25-26 second pace too and only really gets challenging at 20-22 second pace (pretty substantial difference).

This reminded me of a conversation I had with Kipketer on his indoor WR in Paris 1997. He told me that he "just wanted to show his coach that the training was going well" - which it clearly was as he ran a comically easy 1.44.mid in the semis and backed it up with 1.42.6 in the final (which had only been bettered by like 5 or 6 people outdoors at the time). Nothing special in his training fueling that performance just his fitness and incentive. Could running indoors from 800m onwards be just as fast as outdoors? I wonder if either Kipketer or Giles today stepped onto an outdoor track (in a comparative climate of course) and ran 2 laps would they be so much faster? I doubt it.

So what's different now?

1) Indoor used to be a "training blip" for elites, the lack of competition in 2020 due to Covid see's it as more of a release of pent-up frustration, nerves, fitness caused by the pandemic

2) Athletes have been forced to be even more disciplined in their lives than normal. It really is training-home-training-home. This might seem like something inconsequential but cumulatively the extra potential rest athletes are getting could be more important than we think.

3) Athletes are desperate to run fast. Why? 2020 showed there were no guarantees. The Diamond league was gone and the Olympics postponed. But they still need to hit performances to keep their deals and/or keep their deals. Every outing now - indoor or outdoor has meaning.

4) Footwear arms race - hey I have also been vocal in saying that the realities of the new "super spikes" are that they aren't in reality that new or super. The tech/advantages you see in the road racing product came from track product (stiff curved plates) so that doesn't apply in reverse. What has come from road to track is improvement in foam cushioning which is really still minimal when you are talking 8-10mm of foam max underfoot in any spike (don't be fooled by high visual sidewalls). What it might be doing is helping longer distances in terms of cushion and how cushion reduces fatigue - especially post race and training. It's not making athletes perform at higher levels than what their potential is, more so they are helping athletes better reach their maximum potentials. Either way the whole situation is undoubtedly making athletes believe they have super product which is elevating them and that in itself is highly effective when it comes to performance.

Anyway - back to todays races - great races especially by Giles and Webb. Exciting times ahead.

Is it possible that athletes have come in to this Indoor season more prepared than they have in previous years due to the lack of racing opportunities.

Maybe these fast times are just a byproduct of athletes being in peak shape, rather than just doing indoors as a mid winter test of fitness.

CopperRunner wrote:

It should be interesting! Brazier once again has broken his indoor record, but it’s a little more than half a second slower than this run.

Brazier however, didn’t look all that tired. Did he look this way because he actually wasn’t tired, or was it because he has incredible form when tired. Maybe that’s the question to be answered.

I don't think Brazier is close to top form. He can run 1:43-1:44 pretty much on 80% fitness, which is where he is. I don't really make the distinction between indoor and outdoor any more. You can run just as fast indoors at 800 up. The surface is great, perfect conditions etc. That being said 1:43.6 is a step up for Giles whether it's run indoors or out. Gives him a chance to be in the medal picture. You will have to be in 1:42 shape and navigate the rounds to get on the podium though with all of the guys in the mix now.