This thread was deleted by a volunteer moderator. I certainly don't want a thread this big deleted so I've restored. THat being said, this thread has served it's purpose. I've closed it to new posts.
We have a new 2024 vaccine thread here. New people don't need to try to wade through 20,000 posts to figure out what is going on.
Read the whole thing and remain a lab-leaker challenge.
I know the rationalist discourse can be off-putting for some, but this is worth it.
I read enough of this to deduce that the win was a result of superior debating skills, not the truth.
For example, one of the key arguments against the lab leak scenario was that the odds of it being a lab leak and then the first major breakout occurring at the wet market was 10,000 to 1.
It took me less than 5 minutes to destroy that 10,000 to 1 premise.
Here's how the virus could resulted from a lab leak but only surfaced first at the wet market.
1. The reason the original virus wasn't the most likely way a lab would modify a virus is that the lab was most likely experimenting with different ways to make the virus more contagious to humans. The virus that escaped was one of these modified but inferior versions.
2. A young lab worker made a negligent mistake and was exposed to the virus. A young, inexperienced lab worker would be more likely to make a mistake than an experienced scientist.
3. Chinese are marrying later in life so it wouldn't be unlikely at all for this worker to be single and live alone. Thus, there was no immediate family to spread it to.
4. He got sick but he was extremely careful around coworkers at WIV because he knew he would get fired if it came out that he got infected from his negligence at the lab. Because he is extremely cautious at the lab and tells no one that he's sick, he infects no one at the Wuhan lab.
5. Because he felt sick, he didn't socialize so he didn't spread the virus around town, but he still had to eat.
6. He bought his food at the Wuhan wet market. While at the market he infected a wet market worker who was far less sanitary then the Wuhan lab worker.
7. This infected wet market worker spread the virus to some of his animals and many of his customers, making the Wuhan wet market the site of the original outbreak.
You don't have to be Sherlock Holmes to apply Occam's Razor to see that the lab leak is far more likely than a spread from Raccoon Dogs.
Heck, the Raccoon Dog theory provides NO premise on how the Raccoon Dogs got COVID in the first place. If you can't make a compelling case for how THAT happened, then the whole Raccoon Dog theory falls apart.
Fisky these are all rational explanations of what occurred but they are highly highly implausible compared to the zoonosis. You have to construct an 8 step argument with no supporting evidence to counter the single part of the argument regarding the wet market. That’s exactly the point of the zoonosis side! Sure, you can explain it but it requires taking much more implausible logical leaps.
Frankly the furin cleavage site is the killer argument. The way the furin site is inserted is so much more complicated than a human would do, and uses an incorrect sequence that only worked by chance, that it clearly was not of human origin.
Lastly, if you read the whole argument and say “well this side was better at debating and more convincing, but I’m still gonna believe the other side” you simply weren’t open minded to begin with.
Read the whole thing and remain a lab-leaker challenge.
I know the rationalist discourse can be off-putting for some, but this is worth it.
Nobody will actually change their mind because of this. All the lab leakers stopped paying attention to new research years ago. It’s a religious belief at this point.
Fisky these are all rational explanations of what occurred but they are highly highly implausible compared to the zoonosis. You have to construct an 8 step argument with no supporting evidence to counter the single part of the argument regarding the wet market. That’s exactly the point of the zoonosis side! Sure, you can explain it but it requires taking much more implausible logical leaps.
Frankly the furin cleavage site is the killer argument. The way the furin site is inserted is so much more complicated than a human would do, and uses an incorrect sequence that only worked by chance, that it clearly was not of human origin.
Lastly, if you read the whole argument and say “well this side was better at debating and more convincing, but I’m still gonna believe the other side” you simply weren’t open minded to begin with.
My premise is far more plausible than zoonosis.
Let's begin with what we know. The first outbreak of covid-19 was at the Wuhan wet market. The closest known natural virus to SARS COV 2 is found in bats that live 1,000 miles away.
Your premise is that somehow this virus...
- mutated to another species which
- then traveled 1,000 miles
- without infecting anyone along the way
- and then emerged as a mature virus
- only 5 miles away from WIV.
Additionally,, in your premise, all of the following have to be coincidences:
1. the fact that WIV was known to have specimens from that specific bat,
2. that WIV was known to be doing gain of function research, and
3. WIV was known to have safety concerns as recently as 2018.
In view of those astounding coincidences, explain how your premise is more plausible than mine.
Fisky these are all rational explanations of what occurred but they are highly highly implausible compared to the zoonosis. You have to construct an 8 step argument with no supporting evidence to counter the single part of the argument regarding the wet market. That’s exactly the point of the zoonosis side! Sure, you can explain it but it requires taking much more implausible logical leaps.
Frankly the furin cleavage site is the killer argument. The way the furin site is inserted is so much more complicated than a human would do, and uses an incorrect sequence that only worked by chance, that it clearly was not of human origin.
Lastly, if you read the whole argument and say “well this side was better at debating and more convincing, but I’m still gonna believe the other side” you simply weren’t open minded to begin with.
My premise is far more plausible than zoonosis.
Let's begin with what we know. The first outbreak of covid-19 was at the Wuhan wet market. The closest known natural virus to SARS COV 2 is found in bats that live 1,000 miles away.
Your premise is that somehow this virus...
- mutated to another species which
- then traveled 1,000 miles
- without infecting anyone along the way
- and then emerged as a mature virus
- only 5 miles away from WIV.
Additionally,, in your premise, all of the following have to be coincidences:
1. the fact that WIV was known to have specimens from that specific bat,
2. that WIV was known to be doing gain of function research, and
3. WIV was known to have safety concerns as recently as 2018.
In view of those astounding coincidences, explain how your premise is more plausible than mine.
The article deals with assessing all of these coincidences. Coincidences alone are not evidence - nearly every rare event will have many highly improbably coincidences associated with it.
The Wuhan strain shows no evidence of being cultured in cells in a dish (characteristic mutations always arise, they didn’t), or being engineered.
That is an even more massive coincidence. Somehow these researchers avoided mutating their viral strain in a way every other corona virus they study get mutated? Stretches belief.
All of your concerns were exhaustively covered in the article. There is no proof, and there never will be. From an unbiased perspective, the balance of the evidence lies with non-lab leak.
(lastly, wouldn’t it make sense to put the WIV where you think you’ll get coronavirus outbreaks 😉, maybe not such a coincidence after all)
#1 Twitch Streamer in Shock After Receiving Cancer Diagnosis at Age 32: One of the most popular video game streamers of all time, Ninja, has been diagnosed with skin cancer. He received at least three Covid jabs.
The video game streamer’s shocking medical assessment comes as UK cardiologist Aseem Malhotra earlier this week shared an article by esteemed cancer specialist Angus Dalgleish, a professor of Oncology at St George’s Hospital Medical School, London, in which he highlighted how melanoma patients have relapsed following Covid booster jab injections.
The words below from one of the world’s most distinguished cancer specialists who also has additional unique expertise in immunology & vaccine development are very concerning and should be noted by every medical professional 👇🏼
Angus Dalgleish: Professor of Oncology at St… — Dr Aseem Malhotra (@DrAseemMalhotra) March 24, 2024
Here’s what Dr. Dalgleish said regarding melanomas and other cancers in relation to Covid-19 jabs in the article published by the Daily Sceptic last year, where he went on to call for all mRNA vaccines to be banned
Let's begin with what we know. The first outbreak of covid-19 was at the Wuhan wet market. The closest known natural virus to SARS COV 2 is found in bats that live 1,000 miles away.
Your premise is that somehow this virus...
- mutated to another species which
- then traveled 1,000 miles
- without infecting anyone along the way
- and then emerged as a mature virus
- only 5 miles away from WIV.
Additionally,, in your premise, all of the following have to be coincidences:
1. the fact that WIV was known to have specimens from that specific bat,
2. that WIV was known to be doing gain of function research, and
3. WIV was known to have safety concerns as recently as 2018.
In view of those astounding coincidences, explain how your premise is more plausible than mine.
You're wasting your time engaging with Harambe, and the other trolls here, as if they're anything other than trolls, morons, and/or paid disinfo agents and the likes. If these people were intelligent critical thinkers they'd have been anti-vaxx years ago.
Let's begin with what we know. The first outbreak of covid-19 was at the Wuhan wet market. The closest known natural virus to SARS COV 2 is found in bats that live 1,000 miles away.
Your premise is that somehow this virus...
- mutated to another species which
- then traveled 1,000 miles
- without infecting anyone along the way
- and then emerged as a mature virus
- only 5 miles away from WIV.
Additionally,, in your premise, all of the following have to be coincidences:
1. the fact that WIV was known to have specimens from that specific bat,
2. that WIV was known to be doing gain of function research, and
3. WIV was known to have safety concerns as recently as 2018.
In view of those astounding coincidences, explain how your premise is more plausible than mine.
You're wasting your time engaging with Harambe, and the other trolls here, as if they're anything other than trolls, morons, and/or paid disinfo agents and the likes. If these people were intelligent critical thinkers they'd have been anti-vaxx years ago.
China, Moderna, Pfizer, Fauci, Trump, Biden, Walensky, Kory. They all pay me. Keeps food on the table.
These guys on here are clowns, keyboard warriors with no medical or virology credentials. Here’s a guy with both. Amazing how shunned he was despite his great treatment success.
The Imperial County Board of Supervisors meeting on December 21, 2021 featured a presentation on the early treatment of COVID-19 by two local physicians, Dr. George Fareed and Dr. Brian
After 30 years in the Imperial Valley, Dr. George Fareed has comfortably settled into the role of the old country doctor. One day might call for him to remove a
“But while Fareed has embraced the role of country doctor, he’s much more than that. He’s also a world-class virologist, going back to his days in the early 1970s at the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), back when current director Dr. Anthony Fauci was still a clinical associate.
Fareed’s work at NIAID earned him an invitation to become a professor at Harvard University, where he’d earned his own medical degree in 1970.”
“Doctors who were propagandized by this would tell their patients, ‘Don’t take that; it’s going to hurt you,’ or ‘You do what the government says, which is go home and rest and take some chicken soup and vitamins. If you get worse, come back and we’ll put you on a ventilator.’ And so it’s been a terrible, disgraceful story,” Fareed said.
The people who make such decisions are “outside the circle of empathy; they don’t know,” he said. “They don’t treat these COVID patients. Dr. Fauci, for instance, the head of the FDA, the NIH people. And I was there. I could have spent my life at the NIAID, but I’m glad I didn’t.”
Harambe and 300k bro killed people. They and their ilk are responsible for millions of deaths. Dogma is deadly. This is before vaccines were even available or even during the Delta wave. Simply put, you have a couple amateur scientists on here as “fact checkers.” They literally are responsible for people dying with their propaganda.
Harambe and 300k bro killed people. They and their ilk are responsible for millions of deaths. Dogma is deadly. This is before vaccines were even available or even during the Delta wave. Simply put, you have a couple amateur scientists on here as “fact checkers.” They literally are responsible for people dying with their propaganda.
I just opened this thread for the first time to see what you guys could possibly still be discussing here, and here is a poster accusing Harambe the gorilla of being a murderer ??? wtf hahahhha you guys are CRACKED
These guys on here are clowns, keyboard warriors with no medical or virology credentials. Here’s a guy with both. Amazing how shunned he was despite his great treatment success.
“But while Fareed has embraced the role of country doctor, he’s much more than that. He’s also a world-class virologist, going back to his days in the early 1970s at the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), back when current director Dr. Anthony Fauci was still a clinical associate.
Fareed’s work at NIAID earned him an invitation to become a professor at Harvard University, where he’d earned his own medical degree in 1970.”
“Doctors who were propagandized by this would tell their patients, ‘Don’t take that; it’s going to hurt you,’ or ‘You do what the government says, which is go home and rest and take some chicken soup and vitamins. If you get worse, come back and we’ll put you on a ventilator.’ And so it’s been a terrible, disgraceful story,” Fareed said.
The people who make such decisions are “outside the circle of empathy; they don’t know,” he said. “They don’t treat these COVID patients. Dr. Fauci, for instance, the head of the FDA, the NIH people. And I was there. I could have spent my life at the NIAID, but I’m glad I didn’t.”
Harambe and 300k bro killed people. They and their ilk are responsible for millions of deaths. Dogma is deadly. This is before vaccines were even available or even during the Delta wave. Simply put, you have a couple amateur scientists on here as “fact checkers.” They literally are responsible for people dying with their propaganda.
Lol you can't even say what this genius treatment protocol is. Because it doesn't work. This guy is a quack or innumerate.
It's very easy to con yourself into thinking your genius 'protocol' works with a simple cognitive bias. Basically: you only refer people who are not very sick and/or low risk for your 'protocol' but you refer riskier people for more care.
Follow up on your hunch and look: nobody you sent with your protocol ended up very sick, but a few of people you didn't ended up sicker. You're a genius and cured COVID! See what went wrong? This is where the 'randomized' part of 'randomized controlled trial' is extremely important.
Harambe and 300k bro killed people. They and their ilk are responsible for millions of deaths. Dogma is deadly. This is before vaccines were even available or even during the Delta wave. Simply put, you have a couple amateur scientists on here as “fact checkers.” They literally are responsible for people dying with their propaganda.
I just opened this thread for the first time to see what you guys could possibly still be discussing here, and here is a poster accusing Harambe the gorilla of being a murderer ??? wtf hahahhha you guys are CRACKED
The antivaxxers tend to lose the plot and have apoplectic meltdowns every few days. I can almost feel the spit sprayed all over their computer monitors as they rage at me.
Rahi Abouk, John S. Earle, Johanna Catherine Maclean, Sungbin Park
Founded in 1920, the NBER is a private, non-profit, non-partisan organization dedicated to conducting economic research and to disseminating research findings among academics, public policy makers, and business professionals.
Analysis shows that vaccine mandates exacerbated the staffing shortage. Arguably not good!
However, the paper makes no attempt to compare the quality of the worker removed / replaced by the mandates. Purging low IQ workers from healthcare may have been a net positive even if we had to endure a staffing shortage. There are a lot of medical mistakes.
These guys on here are clowns, keyboard warriors with no medical or virology credentials. Here’s a guy with both. Amazing how shunned he was despite his great treatment success.
“But while Fareed has embraced the role of country doctor, he’s much more than that. He’s also a world-class virologist, going back to his days in the early 1970s at the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), back when current director Dr. Anthony Fauci was still a clinical associate.
Fareed’s work at NIAID earned him an invitation to become a professor at Harvard University, where he’d earned his own medical degree in 1970.”
“Doctors who were propagandized by this would tell their patients, ‘Don’t take that; it’s going to hurt you,’ or ‘You do what the government says, which is go home and rest and take some chicken soup and vitamins. If you get worse, come back and we’ll put you on a ventilator.’ And so it’s been a terrible, disgraceful story,” Fareed said.
The people who make such decisions are “outside the circle of empathy; they don’t know,” he said. “They don’t treat these COVID patients. Dr. Fauci, for instance, the head of the FDA, the NIH people. And I was there. I could have spent my life at the NIAID, but I’m glad I didn’t.”
Harambe and 300k bro killed people. They and their ilk are responsible for millions of deaths. Dogma is deadly. This is before vaccines were even available or even during the Delta wave. Simply put, you have a couple amateur scientists on here as “fact checkers.” They literally are responsible for people dying with their propaganda.
Lol you can't even say what this genius treatment protocol is. Because it doesn't work. This guy is a quack or innumerate.
Yes, Harambe gets the last word on a Harvard-trained physician and virologist who cut his teeth at the NIAID. Harambe, with his complete lack of credentials.
Nope, Dr Fareed treated many, many serious patients too. He and Tyson treated over 7,000 sick patients, with great success.
Harambe’s propaganda killed millions of people who might otherwise have never been admitted to the hospital. This dude is a quack and a murderer.
This is not a commentary on the vaccine. It’s simply an assessment of what could’ve been done before vaccination was available or among risky patients who otherwise refused.
As far as vaccine mandates for healthcare workers? Completely unnecessary in staff who had already acquired natural immunity.
Lol you can't even say what this genius treatment protocol is. Because it doesn't work. This guy is a quack or innumerate.
Yes, Harambe gets the last word on a Harvard-trained physician and virologist who cut his teeth at the NIAID. Harambe, with his complete lack of credentials.
Nope, Dr Fareed treated many, many serious patients too. He and Tyson treated over 7,000 sick patients, with great success.
Harambe’s propaganda killed millions of people who might otherwise have never been admitted to the hospital. This dude is a quack and a murderer.
This is not a commentary on the vaccine. It’s simply an assessment of what could’ve been done before vaccination was available or among risky patients who otherwise refused.
As far as vaccine mandates for healthcare workers? Completely unnecessary in staff who had already acquired natural immunity.
I have more credentials than Fareed. And I clearly don't fall for the same obvious, college-freshman level cognitive biases.
Yes, Harambe gets the last word on a Harvard-trained physician and virologist who cut his teeth at the NIAID. Harambe, with his complete lack of credentials.
Nope, Dr Fareed treated many, many serious patients too. He and Tyson treated over 7,000 sick patients, with great success.
Harambe’s propaganda killed millions of people who might otherwise have never been admitted to the hospital. This dude is a quack and a murderer.
This is not a commentary on the vaccine. It’s simply an assessment of what could’ve been done before vaccination was available or among risky patients who otherwise refused.
As far as vaccine mandates for healthcare workers? Completely unnecessary in staff who had already acquired natural immunity.
I have more credentials than Fareed. And I clearly don't fall for the same obvious, college-freshman level cognitive biases.
🤣🤣🤣
Unfortunately, unlike you, he has non message board credentials.
Yes, Harambe gets the last word on a Harvard-trained physician and virologist who cut his teeth at the NIAID. Harambe, with his complete lack of credentials.
Nope, Dr Fareed treated many, many serious patients too. He and Tyson treated over 7,000 sick patients, with great success.
Harambe’s propaganda killed millions of people who might otherwise have never been admitted to the hospital. This dude is a quack and a murderer.
This is not a commentary on the vaccine. It’s simply an assessment of what could’ve been done before vaccination was available or among risky patients who otherwise refused.
As far as vaccine mandates for healthcare workers? Completely unnecessary in staff who had already acquired natural immunity.
I have more credentials than Fareed. And I clearly don't fall for the same obvious, college-freshman level cognitive biases.
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