Serious discussion: Israel has the most cases of covid per capita in the world right now. What is going on?

501miler wrote:

Because people to this day (just check on the letsrun forum) refuse to wear masks and a hesitancy to get vaccinated, make the spread of more variants very likely.

There is not a single reputable, peer-reviewed study showing masks to be effective.

Theere are many showing the opposite, including from the CDC.

Below are 7 studies that found masks are ineffective at stopping COVID-19 like viruses.

American Greatness:

Jacobs, J. L. et al. (2009) “Use of surgical face masks to reduce the incidence of the common cold among health care workers in Japan: A randomized controlled trial,” American Journal of Infection Control, Volume 37, Issue 5, 417–419.

N95-masked health-care workers (HCW) were significantly more likely to experience headaches. Face mask use in HCW was not demonstrated to provide benefit in terms of cold symptoms or getting colds.

Radonovich, L.J. et al. (2019) “N95 Respirators vs Medical Masks for Preventing Influenza Among Health Care Personnel: A Randomized Clinical Trial,” JAMA. 2019; 322(9): 824–833.

“Among 2862 randomized participants, 2371 completed the study and accounted for 5180 HCW-seasons. … Among outpatient health care personnel, N95 respirators vs medical masks as worn by participants in this trial resulted in no significant difference in the incidence of laboratory-confirmed influenza.”

Long, Y. et al. (2020) “Effectiveness of N95 respirators versus surgical masks against influenza: A systematic review and meta-analysis,” J Evid Based Med. 2020; 1–9.

“A total of six RCTs involving 9,171 participants were included. There were no statistically significant differences in preventing laboratory-confirmed influenza, laboratory-confirmed respiratory viral infections, laboratory-confirmed respiratory infection, and influenza-like illness using N95 respirators and surgical masks. Meta-analysis indicated a protective effect of N95 respirators against laboratory-confirmed bacterial colonization (RR = 0.58, 95% CI 0.43-0.78). The use of N95 respirators compared with surgical masks is not associated with a lower risk of laboratory-confirmed influenza.”

Cowling, B. et al. (2010) “Face masks to prevent transmission of influenza virus: A systematic review,” Epidemiology and Infection, 138(4), 449-456.

None of the studies reviewed showed a benefit from wearing a mask, in either HCW or community members in households (H). See summary Tables 1 and 2 therein.

Bin-Reza et al. (2012) “The use of masks and respirators to prevent transmission of influenza: a systematic review of the scientific evidence,” Influenza and Other Respiratory Viruses 6(4), 257–267.

“There were 17 eligible studies. … None of the studies established a conclusive relationship between mask/respirator use and protection against influenza infection.”

Smith, J.D. et al. (2016) “Effectiveness of N95 respirators versus surgical masks in protecting health care workers from acute respiratory infection: a systematic review and meta-analysis,” CMAJ Mar 2016

“We identified six clinical studies … . In the meta-analysis of the clinical studies, we found no significant difference between N95 respirators and surgical masks in associated risk of (a) laboratory-confirmed respiratory infection, (b) influenza-like illness, or (c) reported work-place absenteeism.”

Offeddu, V. et al. (2017) “Effectiveness of Masks and Respirators Against Respiratory Infections in Healthcare Workers: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis,” Clinical Infectious Diseases, Volume 65, Issue 11, 1 December 2017, pages 1934–1942,

“Self-reported assessment of clinical outcomes was prone to bias. Evidence of a protective effect of masks or respirators against verified respiratory infection (VRI) was not statistically significant.”

Will be peer-reviewed VERY soon. But the initial reception has been outstandingly positive for methodology and analysis.

RCT for COVID-19 infection, 350k people.

makes older studies look very very underpowered in comparison.

Noyankee wrote:

KoyPond wrote:

They are also the most vaccinated. It isn’t a coincidence. The vaxxed are spreading.

This is the only logical conclusion. You can spin all the data you’d like and speak to every Dr, but logic does not lie. The vaccinated absolutely must be spreading this virus. Fauci didn’t mention this amongst his propaganda did he folks?

Since it doesn't help actually explaining the lack of logic in this, how about some proper data:

Or, even in South Africa

I am Sam wrote:

Noyankee wrote:

This is the only logical conclusion. You can spin all the data you’d like and speak to every Dr, but logic does not lie. The vaccinated absolutely must be spreading this virus. Fauci didn’t mention this amongst his propaganda did he folks?

Since it doesn't help actually explaining the lack of logic in this, how about some proper data:

https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated

Or, even in South Africa

https://twitter.com/pietcroucamp/status/1434919470582091779?s=20

Their brains cannot understand data, only partisan sound bites from media hacks.

Israel also didn't attempt to vaccinate Palestinians on a large scale, including many living in Israel, and that left a large reservoir of potential COVID cases to pass back to Israelis as they got careless. I understand also that Israel, while having strict laws on the books, didn't enforce mask mandates and so when a highly transmissible variant appeared, it spread quickly with a careless populace not wearing masks and surrounded by a large population of the unvaccinated.

“Their brains cannot understand data, only partisan sound bites from media hacks.[/quote]”

It must be getting awful challenging finding data to back up your bizarre claim that the unvaccinated are spreading the virus when we have 300% more cases this year with the vaccine than last year without the vaccine and more variants.

The logic is pretty simple overthinkers. If you get vaccinated then you are adding to this issue.. .

High COVID infection rates are moving gradually north already and have started to hit the midwest and rural west. South Dakota already has high rates, as does Idaho, and Virginia is getting more, as is Ohio. It will move to the northeast by early November but the northeast will not be hit anywhere near as hard as Florida and Louisiana and South Carolina, and so forth, have been hit because the vaccination rate is much higher in the northeast.

As for the NFL, 93% are now vaccinated. They are tested very frequently and so would stand to have positives show up in the data, unlike the general population where most aren't tested often. But the positivity rate is far, far lower among NFL players and personnel than the general population. Florida recently hit over 20% test positivity rates, while the NFL reports at the same time a test positivity rate of just 0.95%. Vaccinated players tested positive at a rate of just 0.3%, despite being in close proximity a lot to unvaccinated players, who tested positive at a 2.2% rate. So, the unvaccinated tested positive at 7 times the rate of the vaccinated. The union wants daily testing but the NFL wants weekly.

https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-says-player-vaccination-rate-at-93-weekly-testing-for-fully-vaccinated-playe

That's utter nonsense. Delta started spreading before widespread vaccination and it is simply much more transmissible. You spread it to 6 people on average, vs. 2 for alpha. Do the math for five cycles of infection and transmission and you'll see how much harder it's become:

First Infection:

Alpha 1

Delta 1

Second Stage of infections:

Alpha 2 additional cases

Delta 6 additional cases

Third Stage of infections

Alpha 4 new infections

Delta 36 new infections

Fourth Stage of infections

Alpha 8 new infections

Delta 216 new infections

5th Stage:

Alpha 16 new infections

Delta 1296 new infections

6th Stage:

Alpha 32 new infections

Delta 7776 new infections

Cases were decreasing rapidly in the U.S., and deaths and hospitalizations too, as vaccination spread, until Delta took root in southern areas with low vaccination rates and limited mask compliance.

Noyankee wrote:

“Their brains cannot understand data, only partisan sound bites from media hacks.

”

It must be getting awful challenging finding data to back up your bizarre claim that the unvaccinated are spreading the virus when we have 300% more cases this year with the vaccine than last year without the vaccine and more variants.

The logic is pretty simple overthinkers. If you get vaccinated then you are adding to this issue.. .[/quote]

You clearly didn’t even read Sam’s post.

You proved my point.

As an Israeli citizen, one of the issues is that Israelis hate authority and being told what to do. Partly also from having to deal with authority in the army. Everyone is an expert. So, once people thought this was under control, they just went out as if nothing happened. They also opened up the country to visitors too son.

2600 bro wrote:

Noyankee wrote:

It must be getting awful challenging finding data to back up your bizarre claim that the unvaccinated are spreading the virus when we have 300% more cases this year with the vaccine than last year without the vaccine and more variants.

The logic is pretty simple overthinkers. If you get vaccinated then you are adding to this issue.. .

You clearly didn’t even read Sam’s post.

You proved my point.

Their brains cannot handle simple four factor arithmetic. You need to spell it out using blocks or something.

What if the same demographic that is most susceptible to the virus is also the same demographic that is least likely to vaccinate. Hmm... That could lead to some VERY skewed percentages!

the spike proteins are creating the variants. with more boosters, more variants. it's simple.

the vaccinated will never admit this because their egos are wrapped up in a needle.

sad, really

Noyankee wrote:

“Their brains cannot understand data, only partisan sound bites from media hacks.

”

It must be getting awful challenging finding data to back up your bizarre claim that the unvaccinated are spreading the virus when we have 300% more cases this year with the vaccine than last year without the vaccine and more variants.

The logic is pretty simple overthinkers. If you get vaccinated then you are adding to this issue.. .[/quote]

There's always an excuse, such as "variants" as to why the vaccines are failing and the story keeps changing from the original /infamous "two weeks to stop the spread." Without the government taking responsibility for failing, the sheep can keep buying into the charade and next set of orders because they're too scared or too dumb to think effectively independently. This charade continues due to this issue. It will never end at this rate. Or maybe the end will be when people start dropping dead from blood clots after Getting vaccinated 100 times with ineffective booster shots. Time to wake up.

Steve The Addict^^^^^^^------- wrote:

There's always an excuse, such as "variants" as to why the vaccines are failing and the story keeps changing from the original /infamous "two weeks to stop the spread." Without the government taking responsibility for failing, the sheep can keep buying into the charade and next set of orders because they're too scared or too dumb to think effectively independently. This charade continues due to this issue. It will never end at this rate. Or maybe the end will be when people start dropping dead from blood clots after Getting vaccinated 100 times with ineffective booster shots. Time to wake up.

Not that any of the imbecilic gibberish is correct, but by all means, tell us what TO DO, not just what not to do.

Time5k wrote:

It's not double talk. Delta's a different creature.

arunnerinwa wrote:

+1

So funny the way people were like, "Get vaccinated! You won't get or spread Covid!"

And now they're like, "Stupid. Vaccination isn't about not *catching* Covid. It's just about not getting hospitalized for Covid."

Riiight.

I'm vaccinated, btw. I just find the doublespeak completely inane.

pffffft wrote:

the vaccinated will never admit this because their egos are wrapped up in a needle.

sad, really

They'd rather destroy themselves than admit I was right yet again.

Bad Wigins wrote:

pffffft wrote:

the vaccinated will never admit this because their egos are wrapped up in a needle.

sad, really

They'd rather destroy themselves than admit I was right yet again.

There have been more than 2600 people who have gotten COVID TWICE in the US.

rofl