I've been on the masters scene for years now. I've won plenty of US masters races both on the track and on the roads. Been a finalist at the world meet a few times.
I've never been tested. When I've asked about it, I've been told testing is expensive - so it's just not done often with masters folks.
Like other posters, I share a high level of skepticism about higher performers being clean. It's just wild to see others suddenly drop their times after 7-10 years of running the same times. What explains that otherwise? It's sad.
old guy II I applaud you. Until my knees said no more, I raced in a lot of Masters races. Back then we were not tested for drugs. Cheaters who suddenly beat me in a competition after many losses to me, always spiked my attention. In 1983 at Puerto Rico, I was M40 champion in the 800m, 400mH and 2nd in the 400m. I won all three races in 1985 in Rome. In 1989 in Eugene I won the 400mH. We raced for fun and satisfaction honoring the sport by doing it on ability, smarts and racing luck.
It really doesn't matter if you win or lose, but it does matter that you did your best and everyone was welcome to enjoy the sport as we did. My first coach was Berny Wagner, now in the Hall of Track and Field. He taught me that school marks came first, the team second.
I've been on the masters scene for years now. I've won plenty of US masters races both on the track and on the roads. Been a finalist at the world meet a few times.
I've never been tested. When I've asked about it, I've been told testing is expensive - so it's just not done often with masters folks.
Like other posters, I share a high level of skepticism about higher performers being clean. It's just wild to see others suddenly drop their times after 7-10 years of running the same times. What explains that otherwise? It's sad.
I've always wondered this, so forgive me if it's a weird question, {I'm weird}
Is there much of a "hook up" culture at Masters events?
I mean, its hard to find really fit people in our 60s, so it would make sense if a hook up culture developed
Listen, I just won my age group in my hometown marathon, and it took 8 months of work and figuring out how to deal with the kinds of injuries that crop up when you're running in your 50s, and if a doper in my age group had finished ahead of me I would have been extraordinarily angry. If you need T to feel alive, you do you, but stay the hell out of my race.
Guys like him are part of why I don’t run masters.
Loser.
"part" of the reason.
Tell us more...
Another part is that the experience doesn't compensate for the inconvenience.
I just don't get anything out of traveling, taking time, and spending money, to "race" against a bunch of other geezers, some of whom I know aren't honorable.
In the past 25 years I haven't been to a meet that was farther than 15 minutes drive from home...and if it ran late, I wouldn't even stick around for the 200 near the end, because I had other things to do with my life.
But honestly, if nationals were held in my back yard, I still wouldn't go, for the reason given earlier.
And I'm even more enthusiastic than ex-elites I know, who won't even set foot on a track unless it is to coach or make some appearance. No way they are even trying to sprint, let alone compete at something like masters.
I will, and do, go to the bar with ex-athletes, though. For our money, that's way more fun than "racing" at a track, especially one that you would have to TRAVEL to! Unthinkable.
This is awesome because it shows what a farce senior masters racing is and always has been. No one cares about watching a bunch of doddering old fools attempt to relive their real or imagined glory days. Check out the youtube videos showing 50+ masters races. It is downright painful to watch. Looks more like the rusty Tin Man than running (I should know as a 55 yr old!). On top of that, everyone knows that the podium finishers would get absolutely smoked by any decent HS JV runner.
What the hell is the point? You all would be the first ones to make fun of a pathetic 60yr old, loafer wearing silver fox driving his banana yellow convertible Corvette with the gold digger cheesy girlfriend. But you are that foolish guy, embarrassing yourself so you can have a pissing match against a couple other old bulls chasing something that never was. Is it any surprise that a masters racer would resort to PEDs?
What would be far more interesting is to bring together a bunch of masters doped up good and proper w/ EPO, Deca, Tren + T just to see what the aging human body is capable of. Full transparency and no silly podiums. Everyone tries to smash PBs from 5, 10, 15 years ago. We could even have LRC sub-forum to discuss ideal protocol, dosing levels, sourcing, safety, etc. Now that would be cool (although still painful to watch)
“Also, I have a wife, children and grandchildren that I try to be an example of ethical and honorable behavior for. They would be disappointed if I was caught cheating, and it will never be worth damaging their opinion of me for something that is simply a recreational choice for me.”
My thoughts, Qualls has certainly disgraced himself. Perhaps pathological. Odd to me.
This is awesome because it shows what a farce senior masters racing is and always has been. No one cares about watching a bunch of doddering old fools attempt to relive their real or imagined glory days. Check out the youtube videos showing 50+ masters races. It is downright painful to watch. Looks more like the rusty Tin Man than running (I should know as a 55 yr old!). On top of that, everyone knows that the podium finishers would get absolutely smoked by any decent HS JV runner.
What the hell is the point? You all would be the first ones to make fun of a pathetic 60yr old, loafer wearing silver fox driving his banana yellow convertible Corvette with the gold digger cheesy girlfriend. But you are that foolish guy, embarrassing yourself so you can have a pissing match against a couple other old bulls chasing something that never was. Is it any surprise that a masters racer would resort to PEDs?
What would be far more interesting is to bring together a bunch of masters doped up good and proper w/ EPO, Deca, Tren + T just to see what the aging human body is capable of. Full transparency and no silly podiums. Everyone tries to smash PBs from 5, 10, 15 years ago. We could even have LRC sub-forum to discuss ideal protocol, dosing levels, sourcing, safety, etc. Now that would be cool (although still painful to watch)
This is awesome because it shows what a farce senior masters racing is and always has been. No one cares about watching a bunch of doddering old fools attempt to relive their real or imagined glory days. Check out the youtube videos showing 50+ masters races. It is downright painful to watch. Looks more like the rusty Tin Man than running (I should know as a 55 yr old!). On top of that, everyone knows that the podium finishers would get absolutely smoked by any decent HS JV runner.
What the hell is the point? You all would be the first ones to make fun of a pathetic 60yr old, loafer wearing silver fox driving his banana yellow convertible Corvette with the gold digger cheesy girlfriend. But you are that foolish guy, embarrassing yourself so you can have a pissing match against a couple other old bulls chasing something that never was. Is it any surprise that a masters racer would resort to PEDs?
What would be far more interesting is to bring together a bunch of masters doped up good and proper w/ EPO, Deca, Tren + T just to see what the aging human body is capable of. Full transparency and no silly podiums. Everyone tries to smash PBs from 5, 10, 15 years ago. We could even have LRC sub-forum to discuss ideal protocol, dosing levels, sourcing, safety, etc. Now that would be cool (although still painful to watch)
This is awesome because it shows what a farce senior masters racing is and always has been. No one cares about watching a bunch of doddering old fools attempt to relive their real or imagined glory days. Check out the youtube videos showing 50+ masters races. It is downright painful to watch. Looks more like the rusty Tin Man than running (I should know as a 55 yr old!). On top of that, everyone knows that the podium finishers would get absolutely smoked by any decent HS JV runner.
What the hell is the point? You all would be the first ones to make fun of a pathetic 60yr old, loafer wearing silver fox driving his banana yellow convertible Corvette with the gold digger cheesy girlfriend. But you are that foolish guy, embarrassing yourself so you can have a pissing match against a couple other old bulls chasing something that never was. Is it any surprise that a masters racer would resort to PEDs?
What would be far more interesting is to bring together a bunch of masters doped up good and proper w/ EPO, Deca, Tren + T just to see what the aging human body is capable of. Full transparency and no silly podiums. Everyone tries to smash PBs from 5, 10, 15 years ago. We could even have LRC sub-forum to discuss ideal protocol, dosing levels, sourcing, safety, etc. Now that would be cool (although still painful to watch)
As an old guy, I agree with part of your rant. I don't expect anyone (other than maybe family and other age group competitors) to want to watch masters racing.
But I can see the appeal of racing to the masters competitors. It takes work to stay fit and wanting to test yourself against other people at the same stage of life seems quite normal. People shouldn't have to give up the joy and benefits of competition just because they can't compete in the open age group, just as the lower level elite racers shouldn't give it up just because they can't compete at the Olympic trials.
As an old guy, I agree with part of your rant. I don't expect anyone (other than maybe family and other age group competitors) to want to watch masters racing.
But I can see the appeal of racing to the masters competitors. It takes work to stay fit and wanting to test yourself against other people at the same stage of life seems quite normal. People shouldn't have to give up the joy and benefits of competition just because they can't compete in the open age group, just as the lower level elite racers shouldn't give it up just because they can't compete at the Olympic trials.
I have much respect for older guys who continue to train hard and push themselves. However, at some age competing starts to look silly. I'm not sure where that age cut-off is, but I know when I see it.
Couple of years ago, I had the misfortune of sitting through a masters' race that was tacked on to a HS meet. As the old guys gimped over the finish line, I heard far too many snickering at their times. I initially felt bad for the guys, but then again they invited that ridicule upon themselves.
Competing against yourself remains the ultimate test.
Masters records should only be ratified after testing like the rest of the sport.
The athlete should pay for all or partial testing for ratification. Or USATF should increase master membership and championship race fees to offset the cost of testing across five year increments. Michael Johnson’s American record in the 400 has stood for 25 years.
Face the truth. The majority of 50+masters racers are doing TRT at a minimum and are still running times that a 14yr old could beat.
i think your definition of "truth" is different than my definition of "truth." as far as i can tell, the only truth you got right was that a 14yo could beat me right now. and, while i get in races occasionally with 14yos and 60yos who potentially drive corvettes with golddiggers, i may be racing them, but i ain't using them as any type of rubric for comparisons...
old guy II, i appreciate your perspectives here--go toads! enjoyed a visit with larsen up in eugene this week.
coincidentally, i ran a road mile 9 years ago in flint, and although we weren't running head to head, i ran over a minute faster than hobbs kessler. who cares that he was only 12 ;) ...
that's still my story, and i'm still sticking to it,
i think your definition of "truth" is different than my definition of "truth." as far as i can tell, the only truth you got right was that a 14yo could beat me right now. and, while i get in races occasionally with 14yos and 60yos who potentially drive corvettes with golddiggers, i may be racing them, but i ain't using them as any type of rubric for comparisons...
old guy II, i appreciate your perspectives here--go toads! enjoyed a visit with larsen up in eugene this week.
coincidentally, i ran a road mile 9 years ago in flint, and although we weren't running head to head, i ran over a minute faster than hobbs kessler. who cares that he was only 12 ;) ...
that's still my story, and i'm still sticking to it,
cush
I appreciate your honesty about getting beat by 14 yr olds.
Now if you think that TRT is rare in masters racing, you are fooling yourself. No testing and most US physicians won't hesitate these days to prescribe TRT to borderline low T older guy. Standard TRT prescription is 100-125 mg per week, which far exceeds 7mg average daily endogenous production of healthy young male even when netting out the ester weight.
I could run with Qualls when I was into masters running in my mid to late 50s. I was amazed at his performances in recent years, now I know why. Seems like a scumbag thing to do. The behavior that some can justify to themselves. Embarrassing lack of ethics.
Ah so you admit to being closer to Biden's age... now we know what's behind your insecurities and attacks.
The bulging veins in his arms… that doesn’t happen naturally when you’re 70 years old.
Just my opinion, just by themselves the bulging veins do not necessarily indicate PED use. I have 'rope' veins and am close to 70. It is more the muscle bulk that doesn't look right.
I am sure there a genetic outliers, but there is a another 60+ age grouper from the West Coast that has an eerily similar body structure to Qualls that has been making the podium the both the indoor track and Masters outdoor events leading up to this year's National Outdoor Masters Championships this July 18-21).
Currently, he is entered in two mid distance events. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he 'suddenly' has an injury and decides not to compete. (yep, looking at you Mr. 2:27 and 5:10 seed time). If he does compete and podiums like indoors, he may be a great candidate to test as well.
Note, I am not using my registered name because frankly, he is smart enough to figure out who I am and could kick my slightly slower behind half way around the track.
It’s irresponsible to post unsubstantiated allegations on a public forum about a guy who can easily be identified based on the information you provided. If you have suspicions report them on the anonymous doping hotline, not here. And those times are not even close to the American records.
i think your definition of "truth" is different than my definition of "truth." as far as i can tell, the only truth you got right was that a 14yo could beat me right now. and, while i get in races occasionally with 14yos and 60yos who potentially drive corvettes with golddiggers, i may be racing them, but i ain't using them as any type of rubric for comparisons...
old guy II, i appreciate your perspectives here--go toads! enjoyed a visit with larsen up in eugene this week.
coincidentally, i ran a road mile 9 years ago in flint, and although we weren't running head to head, i ran over a minute faster than hobbs kessler. who cares that he was only 12 ;) ...
that's still my story, and i'm still sticking to it,
cush
I appreciate your honesty about getting beat by 14 yr olds.
Now if you think that TRT is rare in masters racing, you are fooling yourself. No testing and most US physicians won't hesitate these days to prescribe TRT to borderline low T older guy. Standard TRT prescription is 100-125 mg per week, which far exceeds 7mg average daily endogenous production of healthy young male even when netting out the ester weight.
Doddering yes - ban doping we agree there, but the rest of your post is garbage. Maybe you live in a non-running community or you move like Frankenstein, but it's obvious you are not even in the masters scene and just want to talk trash.
There are lots of higher end 50s and 60s runners who still race with good form.
