That’s how I read it as well
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birdbeard wrote:
wannabepro25 wrote:
Won many US titles. But at world championships it’s always been 8th or lower. A change is needed. Doing the same thing over and over can leave your career stagnant.
8th in the world is pretty solid. I'd say our current crop of American women is probably capped at about Monson's performance in the 10,000 this year -- Elise did well in the 5,000.There is just absurd competition at the moment. People capable of 14:00-05 are in a different league.
There's just too many people that would have to have a bad day for our women to medal to make it realistic.
Only insightful comments posted on this thread so far.
Here is The Running Effect podcast interview with Elise which was recorded on October 27th . . . when she likely knew she was leaving BTC . . . and dropped on Nov 2:
Elise plays it close to the vest . . . praising Jerry and her teammates while never mentioning anything about leaving Eugene & BTC.
However, in the last 10 minutes, she does state what's on her mind somewhat: (1) 2023 was her most inconsistent year as a pro, with super highs like USAs and the Monaco mile mixed in with super lows like the LA Grand Prix 5k and the WC 10k; (2) was in the best shape of her life going into WC but believes she had overtrained, thus the very bad 10k race; (3) wanted to close her season with a 1500 but was happy to settle for pacing duties in the Prefontaine 5k; (4) restated the 5k is her event and wants to close the gap to the world's best; . . . and, most important . . . (5) is entering 2024 with "lots of curiosity" and plans to "surprise a lot of people."
Regarding (5), she's off to a great start.
After everything Elise said earlier this year about wanting to race the 1500 instead of the 10k, she now has that opportunity, so expect her to take a rather long hiatus from the 10k . . . opening up a spot behind Monson for another runner to make Paris next year.
With the Paris 5k coming at the beginning of the t&f program, the Oly Trials will be ideal for Elise to win her 4th straight US 5k title then see what she can do in the 1500 if she so chooses.
Elise is very much a people person . . . always praising her teammates & family for helping with her success . . . so, going forward . . . training on her own seems like something she would not enjoy or want to do . . . which makes her next surprise reveal all the more intriguing . . .
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rojo wrote:
Can someone explain to me what the poster is referring to?
They are referring to Parker Valby and Solinsky ... Doubt Jerry cares though, she was not his athlete
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Training with Shelby (who recently moved to Denver) back in CO. Coached by Shelby's sister. This board would explode!
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He exists. His name is Justin. He lives in Provo
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Oregon collapse is good news.
Oregon, equipped with mega bucks, state of the art meds, world class facilities, the athletes vote to leave in mass.
Why
It is the stink of corporate corruption, and greed that permutates the entire Oregon scene. And Eugene and Portland are not the quaint lovely cities of decades ago, where you could escape the dodgy big cities of California and what not. Today the State offers little in the way of a wholesome crime free lifestyle.
Back in the day, I choose Eugene and the U of O as the best choice of Pac-10 schools, as a wholesome traditional environment, with it was, but the Oregon of today is basically the complete opposite. The only plus is cash possibilities, which I might take if good enough.
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You want a wholesome, crime free lifestyle? What the hell does that mean, WHOLESOME? Go train around BYU. That sounds boring as hell.
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Fan Out West wrote:
Elise plays it close to the vest . . . praising Jerry and her teammates while never mentioning anything about leaving Eugene & BTC.
However, in the last 10 minutes, she does state what's on her mind somewhat: (1) 2023 was her most inconsistent year as a pro, with super highs like USAs and the Monaco mile mixed in with super lows like the LA Grand Prix 5k and the WC 10k; (2) was in the best shape of her life going into WC but believes she had overtrained, thus the very bad 10k race; (3) wanted to close her season with a 1500 but was happy to settle for pacing duties in the Prefontaine 5k; (4) restated the 5k is her event and wants to close the gap to the world's best; . . . and, most important . . . (5) is entering 2024 with "lots of curiosity" and plans to "surprise a lot of people."
Regarding (5), she's off to a great start.
After everything Elise said earlier this year about wanting to race the 1500 instead of the 10k, she now has that opportunity, so expect her to take a rather long hiatus from the 10k . . . opening up a spot behind Monson for another runner to make Paris next year.
With the Paris 5k coming at the beginning of the t&f program, the Oly Trials will be ideal for Elise to win her 4th straight US 5k title then see what she can do in the 1500 if she so chooses.
Elise is very much a people person . . . always praising her teammates & family for helping with her success . . . so, going forward . . . training on her own seems like something she would not enjoy or want to do . . . which makes her next surprise reveal all the more intriguing . . .
If I recall, Elise interviewed at one point that Jerry's philosophy was that you had to have a good 10k to have a good 5k (or something like that). If she stopped seeing consistent results last year and wanted to focus more on the short faster stuff then the move makes more sense. She can run 2:00 in the 800m... that is a lot of speed and I doubt it has been her focus.
I don't know if this is true, but there are a lot of posters seem to indicate Jerry's training is one size fits all to an extent.
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Two things that explain why the US suck in running: obviously college running is more important than pro running to the point that coaches want to coach kids rather than olympians (its weird that college running is a thing in itself). No other nation has the resources of college running, yet it doesnt seem to do the US any favours. The other is the over reliance on these teams. Is having the coaches attention spread over so many runners really that good? Is it smart that runners change training philosophy every few years as they change team as they were fotball players?
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ThatsHowItGoes321 wrote:
Two things that explain why the US suck in running: obviously college running is more important than pro running to the point that coaches want to coach kids rather than olympians (its weird that college running is a thing in itself). No other nation has the resources of college running, yet it doesnt seem to do the US any favours. The other is the over reliance on these teams. Is having the coaches attention spread over so many runners really that good? Is it smart that runners change training philosophy every few years as they change team as they were fotball players?
This couldn't be more true.
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rojo wrote:
swanky17 wrote:
Rojo/Gault have you reached out to Jerry/Shalane/BTC for comment/a statement about this? Someone should be asking him/them to explain, even if we think we know why all these athletes are leaving. Or do they hope they can just let this all pass by without any statement??
Considering Jerry didn't give us any quotes when Jon asked him for comments for his NCAA XC preview or after conference last week, why should we bother?
Since my comment got deleted (snowflakes) - journalism sometimes involves effort. Keep asking the question
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elise cranny gone
no more bowerman training
gjert ingebritsen?
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Live simply wrote:
birdbeard wrote:
But also Bowerman could not field a full XC team at this point either.
Ahmed, Mcgorty, Jager, Hicks, Hamilton, Knight.
To be fair, that’s still a heady group.
It is, but quite fragile. Ahmed is starting to slip a beat, McGorty solid for now, Jager one foot out to retirement, Hicks unproven, Hamilton unproven, and Knight wildly inconsistent and injury prone. There just isn't a true cornerstone to that team right now, but perhaps one will emerge. The women's team is in utter disarray. The BowerMEN are on life support, but I'm optimistic and have confidence they'll be back. The Bowerman Babes are fully in the history books. The women's team should just be shuttered at this point.
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fortherecord wrote:
you mean.. **gasps dramatically**.. the insurmountable advantage altitude training over 8000 feet for the majority of the year gives is a problem?? The world map and the thousands of athlete performances after training in relatively high altitude is a big enough clue
Oh really — and where is this 8,000’ where you can train for the majority of the year? Please don’t try and sell us on Park City, it’s a ski area with a HS track and steep snow packed roads (great way to get sued by your athletes).
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5313 wrote:
fortherecord wrote:
you mean.. **gasps dramatically**.. the insurmountable advantage altitude training over 8000 feet for the majority of the year gives is a problem?? The world map and the thousands of athlete performances after training in relatively high altitude is a big enough clue
Oh really — and where is this 8,000’ where you can train for the majority of the year? Please don’t try and sell us on Park City, it’s a ski area with a HS track and steep snow packed roads (great way to get sued by your athletes).
PC is perfect April through November for running. plenty of trails, hills, turf and grass fields, Olympic trading center. head to Flag in the winter months and do some warm weather/sea level stints.
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PC if you can afford it wrote:
5313 wrote:
Oh really — and where is this 8,000’ where you can train for the majority of the year? Please don’t try and sell us on Park City, it’s a ski area with a HS track and steep snow packed roads (great way to get sued by your athletes).
PC is perfect April through November for running. plenty of trails, hills, turf and grass fields, Olympic trading center. head to Flag in the winter months and do some warm weather/sea level stints.
Plus tracks in SLC short drive and at 4,000 to 4,500 feet. Yes one track in PC surrounded by fields and hills.
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There is one simple thing that explains why US distance running struggles. Other countries, especially Kenya and Ethiopia, engage in major doping. The fact that people on here still think this is an actual sport and not the chemistry experiment it obviously is is amusing. Give epo and steroids to a decent college runner and you will get internationally competitive times.
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ThatsHowItGoes321 wrote:
Two things that explain why the US suck in running: obviously college running is more important than pro running to the point that coaches want to coach kids rather than olympians (its weird that college running is a thing in itself). No other nation has the resources of college running, yet it doesnt seem to do the US any favours. The other is the over reliance on these teams. Is having the coaches attention spread over so many runners really that good? Is it smart that runners change training philosophy every few years as they change team as they were fotball players?
As someone not from the US I've been wondering that as well why on earth anyone would rather coach 19year olds to some obscure college competition placements than a freaking olympian to a medal. Those two things aren't even remotely the same and anyone would pick the pros if they could. Just all around such a strange move.
But maybe it shows that I have absolutely zero interest in college running. Its still astonishing that you have not more talen showing up when sourcing from such a large pool of athletes.
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runningchick wrote:
As someone not from the US I've been wondering that as well why on earth anyone would rather coach 19year olds to some obscure college competition placements than a freaking olympian to a medal. Those two things aren't even remotely the same and anyone would pick the pros if they could. Just all around such a strange move.
But maybe it shows that I have absolutely zero interest in college running. Its still astonishing that you have not more talen showing up when sourcing from such a large pool of athletes.
there are hundreds of college coaching jobs with many paying a good wage.
How do the majority of coaches in the rest of the world get paid? I presume many have day jobs and coach a few athletes on the side. The US has a culture of NCAA sports that are big business. And that is the allure here and the reason why most of our best coaches are in the system.
Will be interesting to see if Ritz stays with his group or takes a crack at an Ncaa job where he can make more money.
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