Magness started collecting evidence for things he thought were suspicious before he was let go, so I find it more likely that his lack of comfort of what the NOP was doing was a reason he was fired than it being the case that his firing a reason for him becoming suspicious.
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Coach Magness: i want every kid on the team that's 14 years old and feeling run down to see an endocrinologist.
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Punishment wrote:
but why wrote:
wait, now they are talking about punishing Magness?
yeah punish the whistleblowers, that will definitely get people to step forward and testify
Magness might get—what, a coaching ban?—penalized only 'if' he was in on the doctoring of the medical records. But, the responsibility for actually doing that is the doctor. If Magness was in on it then he should willing accept whatever comes his way.
Magness, hmm , Im not so sure he is the as innocent and honest as he may profess. His noise and so called coaching intellect is a lot verbiage that mounts to him be called a so called expert.Its just theoretical talk. It didn't take NOP long to figure out his BS.
I would like him to take a lie detector test!
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Jann Ullrich wrote:
1. Nobody cares about l-carnitine
2. Nobody cares about an IV that had nothing banned or useful in it. 50ml is a stupid, arbitrary, unenforceable rule.
Anyone caught intravenously infusing themselves with something in order to compete in a running race should be immediately banned from the sport for life and fined all career earnings, with the same punishment applied to their coach, manager and any do-gooder lawyer trying to defend them.
This is sports and not some kind of weird kind of arms race between biological cyborgs. The freakshow now must be terminated and only the severest punishment do this.
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No surprise, here.
erik wrote:
Propublica published a report this morning with some more detail on Dr. Brown altering medical records:
https://www.propublica.org/article/records-in-nike-oregon-alberto-salazar-doping-investigation-do-not-matchAs far as I can tell, what's new is detail on how details about a physical checkup were added to Magness's medical records to, presumably, make it look like more than an L-carnitine infusion was being done. They have copies of Magness's originals vs. Dr. Brown's altered ones.
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In a world where competitors are taking roids and epo, definitely a weak witch hunt. That said, he is definitely a guy who pushes the limits, and he is also definitely a guy who is no scientific genius.
rekrunner wrote:
My question, from the very initial BBC Panorama and ProPublica reports, from Epstein, Marc Daly, Magness and the Gouchers, is not directed at truthfulness, but, taking 100% truthfulness for granted, where is the anti-doping rule violation of an athlete subject to anti-doping rules?
Kara promised us a day of reckoning, based on details not made public but shared with USADA.
Yet here we are, two years later, and the best angle seems to be challenging Alberto's need for testosterone, despite notes from doctors and pharmacists, and alleged infusions that USADA has determined must have exceeded the allowable 50ml infusions. You called this the equivalent of a parking ticket - it still is. (For some reason, I prefer the analogy of "jaywalking".)
My opinion then, was that USADA's only possible course of actions were:
- Turn over evidence to appropriate state, federal, or international authorities, and help facilitate or assist in any investigations in the right jurisdictions
- Lobby WADA to make thyroid, L-carnitine prohibited substances, or somehow make prescription drug abuse a prohibited method
After five years of targeted investigation and testing, and voluntary co-operation from at least 19 former Nike athletes and employees, USADA chasing after 50ml infusions seems to be a desparate act and a tacit admission that they have nothing better.
I'm convinced that USADA didn't leak this report on purpose, because it seems to be 269 pages of embarrassingly little substance confirming an actual anti-doping rule violation ever took place.
The initial BBC Panorama and ProPublica reports were equally premature, sparking a conversation among a population who still doesn't fully understand that thyroid medication never required a TUE, and that L-carnitine is as legal, in all quantities, as a juicy steak.
rojo wrote:
...
Everything he has said has actually been proven to be true. The more that we learn, the more we learn why he was suspicious about what was going on.
...
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Hardly a witch hunt. Thankfully some of the athletes spoke up.
L-Carnitine elevates heart disease risk.
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Not those guys wrote:
At the end of the day, Magness is ... only speaking out now because he got fired.
And I can't fully trust a revenge plot.
Ok I agree with you if your definition of fired means, "Told Alberto he no longer would do the job he wanted him to do as he was uncomfortable with it. Alberto, who had already been witholding paychecks from Magness to help entice him to get on board, told him he had to do it. Magness said he would not so they figured out how to part ways. While parting ways, Magness turned down 5 figures in severance as he refused to sign an NDA."
Yeah. You nailed it buddy.
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rojo wrote:
Not those guys wrote:
At the end of the day, Magness is ... only speaking out now because he got fired.
And I can't fully trust a revenge plot.
Ok I agree with you if your definition of fired means, "Told Alberto he no longer would do the job he wanted him to do as he was uncomfortable with it. Alberto, who had already been witholding paychecks from Magness to help entice him to get on board, told him he had to do it. Magness said he would not so they figured out how to part ways. While parting ways, Magness turned down 5 figures in severance as he refused to sign an NDA."
Yeah. You nailed it buddy.
I was already on the side of Steve and detest Salazar, but did not know about the above details. If those are true, I'm even firmer in those camps and disgusted by those attacking Steve on here.
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3hr-marathoner wrote:
Magness went to HS just 30 minutes away from where Dr. Brown practices and legitimately has Hashimoto's disease. He was diagnosed as a 14 year old.
Magness himself has begun to question whether he wasn't diagnosed by Dr Brown with Hashimoto's as a kid for the performance enhancing effects of the treatment.The point is, though, that he was a kid and Brown was his doctor. Whatever happened back then, it wasn't Magness' fault.
Hashimoto's is an autoimmune disease, so pretty hard to fake a diagnosis. If you have the specific anti-self antibodies, you have it... there's no grey zone. There are other thyroid conditions that don't have objective diagnostic criterion, so this would be a risky thing to give a fake diagnosis for.
Non-autoimmune thyroid conditions could be argued for subjectively by a doctor, as is alleged in the leaked report.
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Richard Virenque wrote:
Jann Ullrich wrote:
1. Nobody cares about l-carnitine
2. Nobody cares about an IV that had nothing banned or useful in it. 50ml is a stupid, arbitrary, unenforceable rule.
Anyone caught intravenously infusing themselves with something in order to compete in a running race should be immediately banned from the sport for life and fined all career earnings, with the same punishment applied to their coach, manager and any do-gooder lawyer trying to defend them.
This is sports and not some kind of weird kind of arms race between biological cyborgs. The freakshow now must be terminated and only the severest punishment do this.
A 51ml iv of saline (or other non ped) creates a cyborg?
Give it a rest on the witch hunting, Richard.
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I work in patient care. It's not all uncommon to complete patient care documentation after the encounter has ended.
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OnTehInside wrote:
Magness has told many people, prior to when this all blew up, that it's EPO, HGH, testosterone, etc. So, L-Carn and TUEs are just the surface.
This is what I really suspected all along.
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rekrunner wrote:
I'm convinced that USADA didn't leak this report on purpose, because it seems to be 269 pages of embarrassingly little substance confirming an actual anti-doping rule violation ever took place.
Aren't you that rekrunner that trusts authorities and always looks for the evidence? Why are you so negative about the evidence-searching authority? Or are you trolling him/her with a different spelling?
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Stem cells wrote:
I work in patient care. It's not all uncommon to complete patient care documentation after the encounter has ended.
Years afterwards you come back and alter them?
That's what you are missing. These documents, according to the BBC and ProPublica report and the leaked USADA report, were obtained years after the incident took place.
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true or not wrote:
Magness, hmm , Im not so sure he is the as innocent and honest as he may profess.
Nike trolls still at it.
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true or not wrote:
Punishment wrote:
Magness might get—what, a coaching ban?—penalized only 'if' he was in on the doctoring of the medical records. But, the responsibility for actually doing that is the doctor. If Magness was in on it then he should willing accept whatever comes his way.
Magness, hmm , Im not so sure he is the as innocent and honest as he may profess. His noise and so called coaching intellect is a lot verbiage that mounts to him be called a so called expert.Its just theoretical talk. It didn't take NOP long to figure out his BS.
I would like him to take a lie detector test!
And I would like you, Neykee shill poster, to take a lye detekter teset
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rojo wrote:
Not those guys wrote:
At the end of the day, Magness is ... only speaking out now because he got fired.
And I can't fully trust a revenge plot.
Ok I agree with you if your definition of fired means, "Told Alberto he no longer would do the job he wanted him to do as he was uncomfortable with it. Alberto, who had already been witholding paychecks from Magness to help entice him to get on board, told him he had to do it. Magness said he would not so they figured out how to part ways. While parting ways, Magness turned down 5 figures in severance as he refused to sign an NDA."
Yeah. You nailed it buddy.
Where is this quote from? You didn't reference the source. I only ask because I haven't seen this and you're a journalist.
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rojo wrote:
Ok I agree with you if your definition of fired means, "Told Alberto he no longer would do the job he wanted him to do as he was uncomfortable with it. Alberto, who had already been witholding paychecks from Magness to help entice him to get on board, told him he had to do it. Magness said he would not so they figured out how to part ways. While parting ways, Magness turned down 5 figures in severance as he refused to sign an NDA."
Yeah. You nailed it buddy.
Where do you get this stuff? If that were true don't you think he would have included it in the original story where he talked about leaving? Or in the follow up to Albertos letter where he responded to being fired?
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What?? wrote:
rojo wrote:
Ok I agree with you if your definition of fired means, "Told Alberto he no longer would do the job he wanted him to do as he was uncomfortable with it. Alberto, who had already been witholding paychecks from Magness to help entice him to get on board, told him he had to do it. Magness said he would not so they figured out how to part ways. While parting ways, Magness turned down 5 figures in severance as he refused to sign an NDA."
Yeah. You nailed it buddy.
Where do you get this stuff? If that were true don't you think he would have included it in the original story where he talked about leaving? Or in the follow up to Albertos letter where he responded to being fired?
I suspect that Nike has hired a PR firm to smear any whistleblowers to sow seeds of doubt about their credibility.
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