deanouk wrote:Well your so called "observations" are clearly skewed by ensuring the drivel you spout backs up any comments made by yourself advocating your "calculator"
idiot
that calculator only backs up what is already known
majority of 1'42 - 1'43 guys are 46 - 47 guys ( most have pbs in this region - NOT speculation )
cram is likely to be in that majority
I have seen practically all of Cram's races
so have i
clearly you learnt nothing
There is absolutely NO evidence whatsoever to support your claim he could run 400m in 46.5, as you claim on this thread. Moreover, there is much to suggest he was a 47.high/48 man in his peak year of 1985
a tt he ran sometime in '85 but no indication if it was before oslo or zurich or in training early in year whilst still in heavy training
all that tt is place an upper limit on his 400
You suggest he would have run 1:42.5 with a solo last lap off a 50.7 first 400m. Well please find me ONE example of an 800m race in which he ran sub 51.0 on the first lap? The only one was in the 4 x 800m WR he ran in 1982, when he covered the first lap in 50.7 off a rolling start, and ended up with 1:44.5
moron
he had a 1'44.45 that year
in '85 he ran 1'42.88
there is no comparison
In his 3 fastest ever 800m he went through 400m in 51 and bits.
1985- 1:42.88 - 51.2/51.7 (drafted to 700m by Cruz)
1986- 1:43.22 - 51.7/51.5 (led up to 600m by Peter Elliott)
1986- 1:43.19 - 51.6/51.6 (paced/drafted to 600m by Darren Clarke)
fool
one of those was totally dictated by cruz & another was a championship where win was only consideration
the rieti run i haven't seen since the day - all depends on how quick the pacer took him thru - if it was 51+, that was poor & cram had to go with that
CRAM: - I THINK SO. I'm never really going to set the world alight at 800m.... The day after I got back from Moscow (European Cup 1500m) I had a very good session of 150s and knew the speed was there so I went to Zurich feeling very confident.....I knew Cruz would be going out in his usual way and I was just determined to HANG ON TO HIM and if I could get past him in the last 200m fair enough. If I couldn't I would just be looking for quite a fast time"
confirms my belief
he was thinking of cruz as primary goal
it was his bad luck cruz coudn't go thru in 49.5/50.0 as above tells you cram wouda followed
So, contrary to what you say, Cram was not willing to go too fast, but rather use Cruz to drag him to a fast time!
idiot
he was expecting cruz to go thru in 49.5/50.0 as everyone else did, NOT 51
CRAM responds with several races, but finishes with,...."Or when I ran a 47.6 relay leg in China last year;..."
in the context of a season where his best was 3'33.1 & no 800 of any note
in that context, 47.6 relay is excellent
Even in training I've been running low 23s for 200 with a couple of yards rolling start, which isn't fantastic but is pretty good fom me
& these sound like reps not a one-off
so use your brain & think what that might be if a 1-off 200
something in region of 22+, which is more than enough for 46+ off 22+/24+, with usual 2s differential for 400 guys & cram's mighta been tighter due to better endurance
AND I'VE RUN A 48.1 400TIME TRIAL THIS YEAR."
he gives no indication of when this was
if it was before zurich/oslo that's a authoritative number
if it was in february/march during heavy training, it tells us nothing
So he cites a 47.6 (worth about 48.3) relay as one of his most pleasing runs, and he states that he ran a 48.1 tt in 1985 his best season
see above
As I suggested in an earlier post, with top runners around him in a couple of 400 races in mid summer he could possibly have got down to 47.5 in an open 400m
nonsense
There is no way he was ever going to run a 46.5 when he ran that Mile WR, just like anything approaching 1:42.5 would only be achieved in a similar race to the one in Zurich; i.e being drafted through a 51 first lap and then up to 600/700m in the same fashion Cruz did in Zurich.
idiot
majority of 1'42 - 1'42.5 guys go 46+ & that's what you go to as starting figure
as for zurich - idiot, anyone with a clue about the sport wouda expected cruz to go 49.5/50.0 & that means cram wouda expected to go thru in the same as his stated tactic was to stick to cruz
it was his bad luck that in his 1 major 800 of the year cruz coudn't manage more than a pedestrian 51
i have no doubt cram wouda gone at least 1'42.5 if cruz had managed 49.5/50.0 opener