P-4 conference roster cap coming

Just because the business office moves numbers on a computer does not mean that they have a stash of cash under the AD's desk. Let me put it this way. If student athletes had the right to get their scholarship up front in cash but were responsible for paying their balance with it, they would be screwed. The is no money that could be taken to the bank and deposited. This is called the discount rate. I call it creative bookkeeping. Even if the athletic department offsets the loss of revenue for giving people free school by paying the academic side of campus doesn't change the fact that there is not one real dollar. This is the scam of college. The cost of school is not the cost of school. They can afford to fund scholarships because the 40k a year school actually only cost 20k after factoring the discount rate. They have to make sure they make a little money on every kid while showering then with fake money. The academic side is no better. institutional aid is not real. At best it is a stop gap for a revenue loss on tuition room and board. What's worse is that while they are fleecing the students the school could let everyone go for free out of their 20 billion dollar endowment that would not even move the needle after debiting it. Scholarship is not the issue for funding. Budgets and salaries are what has to be funded for the checks being written out of the business office

Tell me you’ve never worked in a D1 athletic department (or university in general) without telling me you’ve never worked in an athletic department (or university in general).

You are aware that within financial systems that the business office (and also university) that those numbers you speak of are actual dollars right? There’s not a pile of cash under the ADs desk but in a bank account. Think of it this way: those numbers are like when our money was backed by gold. They’re backed by actual real dollars!

I genuinely don’t know where this idea has come from that universities are just washing away the costs for a wide swath of students. This only adds to the problem - it creates a fake reality of how athletic departments and universities work. Just like saying: “X school’s endowment is huge so they can afford to sponsor all these sports.” Nope. Doesn’t work like that. “Oh you’re paying Saban a gazillion dollars so you can clearly pay the athletes doing all the hard work.” Nope his salary is likely endowed (or a portion of it) by funds specifically given for that purpose as well as other outside sources. But when enough people scream for long enough it becomes reality.

So to everyone who continues to speak as if they have all the answers who have never been in the middle of any of it should probably just stop. We’re in a situation now where big name D1 program are going to drop sports like a bad habit and our amazing Olympic preparation system is going to die with it. So enjoy Paris because its only going downhill from here.

While I am not in complete agreement with your scenario, your conclusion is spot on, the Olympic Sports preparation for the US is facing a dire reckoning.

Former D3 guys don't get it because they attended $60K universities where the net cost was $30K. They don't understand that athletic departments at D1 universities manage their own stack of cash. My daughter has teammates who live off campus and receive $20K in cash from the the university. The athletic department is like a separate business. They literally pay the school for the tuition of the athletes. They pay the housing department for student housing. And the send cash to the students who live off campus.

This is a great point. I worked at a small private D2 school that operated the same way. So I’ve seen both sides of it. And yep - if all that money is fake how are all those athletes living off campus getting cash deposited every month for their room and board?

I have not been in D1 athletic departments. If they do it that way then that just makes it worse. The amount of funny money and shady accounting are not unique to any division, association, or school size. The point of my original comment is the fact that P4 schools (that don't outright cut sports) will turn big time non revenue sports into small school/mid-major models with regional instead of national travel, due to operating budgets. And P4 coaches salaries are not sustainable and they were the only ones making real money. There is no way 200k+ is going to exist with Billy from BFE getting 100k to be the back-up safety. Coincidentally I saw an article this morning about a federal appeals court that ruled that the lawsuit about athletes being considered as employees can continue. Change is coming and it will not be good. How will D3, Juco, low budget and, NAIA schools athletic depts survive with those kids being employees. It destroys money making schools and kills the small school number driven approach because of smaller returns. Scary times

hey ncaa admin, a response to all your ‘no.’ responses when people tried to share what they knew intelligently and politely:

‘Yes.’

It is happening

I asked this question in another thread but figured I would get opinions here. How will this affect lower division 1 schools like an American University that does not have a football team? And is this going to result in an influx to division 3 programs for XC, Track and Field?

I think D3 is the way to go if you want to do XC, Track and Field. By in large they still run things the way it was meant to be but kids are going to have to focus more on academics, which is not a bad thing.

You are misunderstanding what is coming. Walkons will be eliminated in head count sports. Limits are not being imposed in other sports.

D3 complies with Title IX. Schools impose limits in track and field. If many of the previous D1 athketes end up in D3, current D3 arhketes will not have a home.

Well, looks like you all were wrong. OP must have been an intern not knowing anything.

sports.yahoo.com

Sources: NCAA to increase scholarships for sports, with football getting roster limit of 105 players

@RossDellenger

As part of the new revenue-sharing model, by-sport scholarship restrictions will be eliminated, and schools are permitted to offer scholarships to the entirety of their rosters.

Link:sports.yahoo.com/sources-ncaa-to-incre...

I know y’all are obsessed w DI but it’s a might big mess right now and no idea what the future looks like. Many D3 programs hav facilities that match or exceed those mid majors try to chase the D1 dream. imagine dropping that rat race and money chase and eliminating all athletics scholarships. Seems to be what the power schools are trying to achieve. it will be an interesting few years ahead

From the attached article...

Another key change to the scholarship structure: All sports will be considered “equivalency sports,” meaning partial scholarships can be distributed to players.

Roster caps will be hard. Other wise no limit to scholarships. I suppose no minimums either, but title IX matters.

I heard 14/31 XC and track men and 18/45 for women. Lots of men will be hitting portal, that is small compared to current rosters.

Will they announce new sport minimums for DIs? Track's best argument for staying alive is 6 teams for 1 staff. Makes more financial sense to cut tennis or golf and shed all those coaching salaries as opposed to cutting men's track and not women's.

I bet it is cheaper to run men's golf and tennis (even with the coaching staffs) than cross country and track with shared coaching staffs because track will have so many more scholarships, higher travel costs, etc. I'd like to think you are correct but I'm not so sure.

It seems like they will be announcing new sport minimums for D1 doesn't it?

There is one thing that works against track on the women's side for Title IX anyway - on the one hand they can count scholarships 2 & 3 times but on the other hand total dollars spent by gender will be out of wack.

I'm thinking you may see many schools dropping all men's sports except football and basketball. Those with no football already may be less affected by all of this.

That would require a rule change from the NCAA's current minimum for team sports per gender. I hope that does not happen, but at this point I'm not placing any bets.

My understanding is that the NCAA settlement will eliminate scholarship limits for all sports once the settlement is final, and it is anticipated that conferences will enact roster limits for each sport. Is this just for P4 schools? Will the elimination of scholarship limits also apply to other Division I schools? Will Division II keep the same scholarship limits they have had in the past?

This will be really hard on athletic departments. Forever they have been able to use track as an accounting tool. Need more women? Add 25 to the xc roster. Need less men? Cut the track walk ons. Need better GPA and graduation numbers? Count the XC athlete 3 times on this spreadsheet but only one time on this spreadsheet.

I have worked at multiple schools that did not care about performance of the team but used it to correct whatever numbers they needed to send to the ncaa.

How will massive squads work like Texas A&M that has an army of women on books scholarships for APR and Title IX?