What you said is incomplete. Female runners can't take testosterone if they want to compete against females. If they want to compete against males as a trans man then it won't make any difference at the elite level. Gidey with testosterone won't beat the top men.
Correct, she won't beat the top men but she might win Western States;) Gidey on roids isn't running 2:01:39. But Gidey on roids and EPO might run 2:08.
There should only be two categories in sport’s competition, biological male and biological female. Those not in these two categories should be allowed to compete in a special freak category, although these competitions should only be held every thirteen years on an island off the coast of Greenland.
I disagree slightly. If people don’t identify with being a male or female than they can just not participate.
How many of you complaining about this radical trans agenda as applied to sports, voted for it by voting for Leftist (Democrat) politicians?
That's not really fair though. A lot of us are in favor of the Democrat's policies on the environment or on progressive tax reform as it relates to big corporations. I am not a one issue voter who cares more about women's sports than the air quality and income inequality.
I have to balance all my concerns, and since actually breathing clean air that isn't 110° is my top priority, I think we have to listen to Democrats and not just "drill, baby, drill!" Republicans.
How many of you complaining about this radical trans agenda as applied to sports, voted for it by voting for Leftist (Democrat) politicians?
That's not really fair though. A lot of us are in favor of the Democrat's policies on the environment or on progressive tax reform as it relates to big corporations. I am not a one issue voter who cares more about women's sports than the air quality and income inequality.
I have to balance all my concerns, and since actually breathing clean air that isn't 110° is my top priority, I think we have to listen to Democrats and not just "drill, baby, drill!" Republicans.
I tend to agree. My thoughts on about trans athletes in sport might be nuanced but wouldn’t even crack the top 100 on the list of things I care about (and people trying to make it my top issue can eff off)
I cannot wait for this whole ridiculous movement to eat itself.
Me too, but I fear will have to wait a long time. It’s very hard from a logical standpoint to tell young people that they can be any gender they want, and everyone else must go along, except on the field of play.
A lot of people on this board, and I’m sure elsewhere, would like to strike a grand bargain with the transgender movement. They want to affirm that gender isn’t entirely social construct, and can be changed for any reason, and at any time. But they want those people to stay in their biological sexual classification for athletic contests. It’s inconsistent and it isn’t going to work.
The only solution is to go back to the root of the problem, and affirm that gender and sex are the same thing. Affirm what humankind has understood for thousands of years, that men and women are separate and that human kind is permanently binary.
Hey don't worry - all it's going to take is for the Lia Thomas of marathon running to win an Olympics and annihilate the WR and it will all be over. Sadly a generation of deserving female athletes will get shafted the same way female 800m runners were from like 1994-2016, but eventually it will sort itself out.
What is a transgender male? That means you currently have a penis and want to be a female? Just trying to get my facts straight on this. If you are already a man, why would you take testosterone to be more like a woman?
There should only be two categories in sport’s competition, biological male and biological female. Those not in these two categories should be allowed to compete in a special freak category, although these competitions should only be held every thirteen years on an island off the coast of Greenland.
I disagree slightly. If people don’t identify with being a male or female than they can just not participate.
What is a transgender male? That means you currently have a penis and want to be a female? Just trying to get my facts straight on this. If you are already a man, why would you take testosterone to be more like a woman?
A transman is someone who was born female and has transitioned to male.
If someone was born male and transitions to male as someone was saying earlier in the thread as a suggestion for themselves or as a joke, they wouldn't be prescribed testosterone by a medical doctor so there would be no advantage.
From what I can tell this rule is saying if you are male you compete in male category. If you are a transman taking testosterone you compete in the male category. If you are female you compete in the female category. I think people are taking exception to someone being allowed to take testosterone, but I think it's allowed for medical conditions (TUE).
How many of you complaining about this radical trans agenda as applied to sports, voted for it by voting for Leftist (Democrat) politicians?
That's not really fair though. A lot of us are in favor of the Democrat's policies on the environment or on progressive tax reform as it relates to big corporations. I am not a one issue voter who cares more about women's sports than the air quality and income inequality.
I have to balance all my concerns, and since actually breathing clean air that isn't 110° is my top priority, I think we have to listen to Democrats and not just "drill, baby, drill!" Republicans.
You are 100% retarded. You are why this country is messed up.
Ah yes. The United States being too concerned about the environment and income inequality is why it trails the rest of the developed world in virtually every conceivable metric of well-being.
Oh, wait. Other countries care about those things more.
The US has the highest GDP and the most freedom. It also has human rights that other countries don't have (the human right to free speech, the human right to bear arms, etc).
I know many trans people. This is simply not how it works. Literally no one is going around “changing their gender for any reason and at any time.” Some of you would really benefit from getting out of your bubble now and then.
You misunderstand - I am saying that we allow people to “change” their gender any time, and we’re all supposed to go along with it.
Yes, how does it affect you? Also, Western States can do whatever they want—not beholden to you
There has never been a documented case of hermaprhoditism in human beings.
You are literally trying to erase people with ovotesticular syndrome from the face of the earth. For what purpose? Because there are narcissists and psychopaths who use their gender ideology as a cover for their misogyny?
What exactly are you trying to accomplish by spreading this binary ideology? Have you ever thought how you would feel to be told that you do not exist in this world?
You're citing Wikipedia and telling me that I'm giving bad information? You don't undersand what biological sex is. It is a reproductive strategy, and in human beings it is binary. One egg combines with 1 sperm to create a new human being. Two gametes, not three, four, five, etc. Binary means composed of or involving two things.
If you define hermaphroditism as having ovarian and testicular tissues in the same body, your definition is correct, but there has never been a case of a human being capable of contributing both an egg and sperm to the reproductive process. This is what people mean when they say true hermaphroditism does not exist in human beings, unlike some animals that have functional male and female parts simultaneously. There are two gametes, and those gametes come from one male and one female. Two distinct bodies. Females contribute the eggs, and males contribute the sperm. Ovotesticular syndrome is a disorder, and the fact that the vast majority of people with this syndrome are infertile shows that it is a disease. This is true of all DSDs. They are diseases of sexual development. That means the normal developmental process went wrong. The exceptions prove the rule, and the rule is binary sex.
Would you argue that chromosomes in human beings don't come in pairs because some people have Down's Syndrome?
None of this really matters in this argument because the real objective is to create smoke and mirrors around one of the most well-established facts in science. In most cases, people without DSDs are appropriating ovotesticular disorder, the rarest DSD, in order to claim that their claims to be both sexes, the wrong sex, or neither sex are true.
I have mixed feelings about this because I'm regularly around people who insist that interests, social roles, and personality traits--commonly grouped under the umbrella term, gender--have no relationship to sex. The sex/gender distinction, though useful for identifying the ways society can police people according to sex, creates a false dichotomy between nature and nurture. I know it doesn't have to do this, but it does in practice because people assume that social norms related to sex are entirely socially constructed. This leads some people to think that gender conforming people, rather than expressing the normative behavior patterns associated with their sex category, are dupes of socialization and morally inferior.
There's also this notion that people "identify" as a gender: woman, man, nonbinary. For people who aren't wrapped up in identity, this is really offensive. I'm a woman because I was born as a baby girl, not because I identify as such.
How many trans people think cis gender people are morally inferior dupes of socialization? Do you have any mass survey data? Or are you choosing to listen to only the most vocal and extreme elements because their outrageous opinions justify your transphobia?
Do you think this person looks down on cis women as morally inferior dupes of socialization?
Well, I read a lot of queer theory published in academic journals and interact with extreme social constructionists. I know their worldviews. I regularly hear people with advanced degrees argue that nearly all sex-related behaviors are due to socialization and accuse anybody who thinks that biological sex is related to behavior as being an essentialist. I've read Judith Butler's Gender Trouble cover-to-cover twice. I've read Gayle Rubin's Thinking Sex several times, lots of Foucault, Michael Warner, David Halperin, etc. In sociology, I've read West & Zimmerman's Doing Gender. I could go on and on. I could show you the several bookshelves full of scholarshp that inform my opinion on this topic. In short, I don't need to be educated by you.
There is nothing transphobic about saying sex is binary. In fact, the very concept of trans relies on the reality of biological sex, as does being gay or lesbian. You're conflating people who have transitioned or identify as trans with postmodern gender ideology. They are not one and the same. The ideology is offensive because it assumes that people who do not want to occupy a novel "gender" category or pharmaceutically alter their bodies actively endorse the stereotypes associated with their biological sex.
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