Half marathon course cutter Ashley Paulson, who served 6 month contamination suspension, wins coveted Badwater 135.

Chip time of 2:36:00 and gun time of 2:37:05? Did she cheat at the Revel Marathon too?

I don’t know. she just has a history of cheating and drug use. Total trash.

You couldn't be more wrong. Look at my Screen name. I looked through every photo to find evidence that Mike Rossi was never on the course. I looked through thousands of photos of marathons to help with the crowdsourced effort to prove that Frank Meza cheated.

I don't see anyone here saying that she is "innocent" or swearing that she definitely ran this race. What I do see is that people have an understanding of what evidence is, and that there is a threshold to "prove" that someone cheated, and that we cheapen ourselves when we accuse people and come to conclusions that are not evidence based.

Said it before, I'll say it again: Post less and search more. Find the proof. Come with the evidence. Knowing the role of evidence in making a case does not make anyone a "goof." Declaring someone guilty without any evidence is the goofy thing to do.

Like in a court case, she will never be found "innocent." She is guilty or not guilty of cheating, based on the evidence or lack thereof. As of today, there is no compelling evidence and she is not guilty of cheating.

LOL, Derek just deleted his reply and the commenter from his Ashley post.

Being unsure about her run because you haven't seen enough evidence to conclusively prove she cheated just means you're not familiar with Badwater and you might not be familiar with 100s.

Derek has his annoying ways AND Ashley was incapable of running the time she's credited with. It's not one or the other.

Or as much attention as I did to.................doping rules..........or running the full course.

With the exception of the technical jargon which I don't have a clue, nor want to, I have loosely followed this thread. I have no connection to any of the principle parties, the race, or ultra races in general.

In my eyes, when an athlete has a background of cheating more than once, the burden of proof is shifted to them to prove they completed any future race legally rather than others finding proof that they did not.

Fair or not in your eyes, when an athlete has cheated multiple times, it is difficult for all but a fraction of logical people to have doubts about any future result.

You would have a lot more people willing to entertain your ideas if Derek was not involved. Just the fact that Derek wrote that comment shows you why.

I'm fairly sure that the Badwater Race Director is familiar with the race. Shall we rehash what his current position is?

The people who operate the race, witnessed it and her performance, have 50 volunteers on the course... shall we rehash their position?

What I learned from that (looking at her total time, split times, race photos and videos) is that she is a better athlete than I thought she was.

Are you saying that if the race director doesn't disqualify someone, that's proof they didn't cheat?

I am absolutely not saying that. Mike Rossi was never disqualified, but the proof that he cheated was overwhelming.

I was responding to the post that suggested I currently see her as "not guilty" because I don't know about the race. My point is that the race director clearly knows the race, watched the race, and has 50 volunteers who watched the race and they have said she is not guilty (based on the current complete lack of evidence to the contrary).

Further, it is not the race director's job, or anyone else's, to prove that she didn't cheat.

The burden is on those who believe she did. They have to prove something. They have not done so. Not even close.

I'm not familiar with the race and have never run a 100. I haven't seen conclusive evidence that there was cheating yet. Can you enlighten me?

Has the marathon investigation guy published anything about what the supposed 'observers' who he says told him she cheated said? Just curious because the original post he put about it was just a lot of speculation. Thats all I am seeing here too about her past 'offenses' a lot of assumptions about her motives and no proof or evidence of any actual cheating.

I also think its odd that if she was going to cheat by having her friend dress like her why she didnt also have her friend dye her hair as well? Pretty simple step to take if you are actually trying to cheat by having someone impersonate you. Why overlook that?

As far as her time being so 'crazy' and 'so much faster' I always thought people on letsrun of all place realized how slow so many of these ultra runners are. Has anyone even bothered to look up PR's for any of these folks? Ashley is a faster runner based on her marathon times than all of these supposed great ultra runners. The woman who's record she broke for example has never even broken 3 hours in the marathon.

And dont start accusing me of not being familiar with ultras. I've run over 20 ultras in my lifetime including multiple 100's. Simple fact of the matter is most ultra runners are slow and someone with a huge engine from being a pro triathlete should expected to perform well. It would be odd for them not.

To conclude Paulson cheated because what she did was humanly impossible is valid argument. To conclude so simply because you don't believe she has what it takes just shows your prejudice.

A lot of the belief that no way Paulson could have run it is because she ran a faster time than the ultra god Scott Jurek. So let's look at Jurek's performance. He ran 24:36, which is 3 hours slower than the course record by Ishikawa Yoshihiko, who has a 2:24 marathon PB. Compared to Yoshihiko, Jurek was not as good in translating Marathon performance into Badwater performance.

Now consider that Yoshihiko run the last 13 miles over 20 minutes slower than Paulson. Many people take this as evidence that Paulson's time for the last 13 miles was impossible. But remember, there is someone who finished the race in 28 hours, but ran the last 13 miles faster than Paulson. To put this into perspective, this is like some 2:39 marathoner run the last 2.6 miles of a marathon in a pace that's 20 seconds faster than Kipchoge. No a 2:39 marathoner is not even capable of running at that pace for a stand alone 2.6 miles, not to say at the end of a marathon.

What I'm trying to say, is that the fact Yoshihiko run the last 13 miles of Badwater over 20 minutes slower than someone who finished the race 7 hours slower than him only means that he ran these last 13 miles really slow compared to his ability. Which further means he could've run a much faster course record if he paced right. Which means even the 21:33 course record is a soft one, let alone Jurek's 24:36. Jurek's time simply isn't as godly as many made it sound like.

There seems to be a LetsRun paradox going on here.

Ultra runners are "hobby joggers" who any decent marathoner could beat if they wanted to run some stupid ultra.

Until people want to use ultra-weak evidence to say that a woman cheated in an ultra. Then these same runners are "gods" who can't be outrun by some "Instagram mom" (even though she is an accomplished, professional triathlete who has run a 2:36 marathon and has won every ultra she has entered).

Or, "These ultra guys are slugs... but SHE can't beat them because they are invincible GOD slugs!"

So, maybe the record she beat was soft? There's, what, 50 females a year? Of those, there might be 1 or 2 that are capable of beating the record? And you're counting on those 1 or 2 to have a record setting day in a hostile environment? I don’t think it's out of the realm of possibilities that everything came together for her that day.... regardless of how annoying she is.

Absolutely. Let's not forget des linden 50k record. But these shoes mainly work on flat hard terrain, not a course like utmb

Yeah it goes from "9 min per mile is walking". To "She's running at 13 min pace? That's humanly impossible. That's lightning fast".