No -- you didn't say anything remotely resembling "subject to the defining characteristics of their sex". You repeatedly said they were the same physiologically, and would respond to steroids the same way because they have the same physiology, until eventually you finally conceded that they differed in degree -- which was precisely the point you were arguing against.
As much as you wish it were so, there is simply no suggestion that missing 3 tests, or forgetting to update a website, means he was doping. This is just bad-faith wishful thinking.
Another thing you want to overlook is that performance is linked to physical training as well as mental psychology. If you are serving a 2-year ban, or a 4-year ban, both your training and psychology can suffer negatively. Athletes can no longer formally train using signatory resources and must make private arrangements, and may even have to find a job, further impacting their ability to train. The negative experience of being banned itself can be a highly demotivating factor.
Jeezus, you are thick - and dishonest. Saying men and women are identical - which I didn't - means they cannot be either male or female, but exactly the same. I said they share a human physiology but it goes without saying they will have sexually defined differences. In terms of peds, these differences are irrelevant, as WADA makes no distinction between the sexes. Both sexes can - and do - dope using the same drugs.
Your point about missing tests is wilful blindness. As I said on another thread, for a top athlete to miss one test might be careless; to miss two is serious and they must realise they cannot miss another without jeopardizing their career and reputation. To miss the third can only be explained by one of two alternatives: they are evading testers because they are doping - which is why WADA treats a three times whereabouts failure as a doping violation - or they are so simple-minded they haven't understood their obligations. That is not an elite or professional athlete. No one suggests that of Manangoi.
On your last point about training, a violation does not prevent an athlete from doing that - as we see with Houlihan. Manangoi may not be expected to be as sharp as when he was regularly competing but his fall-off is so precipitous he is simply not the same athlete. The reason is obvious.
I knew it wouldn't take long for you to call me "thick" after I asked "how thick are you". I think all your insults are just recycled insults you have received over time.
But like all things, you are wrong again -- I am neither thick nor dishonest. Funny how you claim you said something, and next thing you say is "it goes without saying". Anyone interested can scroll back see what you said in response to what. We've gone all over the map because you couldn't ever establish the doping benefit for men in middle distance, resorting first to the "presence" of doping, and then to one example of a woman in 800m, not to mention baseball, sprinting, weightlifting, and cycling and chess and darts and marathoning.
It frankly doesn't matter what you said in another thread -- like this thread, most things you say are nonsense. It is just you painting a cartoon picture with false choices of what you think the world looks like from your vantage point on a little island at the bottom of the world. Manangoi had three whereabouts failures -- not much to infer from that, except that he missed some unscheduled appointments.
The reason for Manangoi's performance changes is obviously not doping, because it is not obvious that any doping would bring 10 seconds to the 1500m.
Yes, such as Kenya has a greater doping problem than most others.
You're assuming Nigerians have a genetic disadvantage at distance running on the basis of their slow NR? What if a Nigerian cone along and shaves 5% off the NR like the Kenyan 100m guy just has?
Pointing on the doping problem in Kenya is not what makes you a racist. That Kenya's doping problem is greater than most others is not yet to see so clearly as you state.
If hundreds of Nigerians start to run close to world records in events from 800m and up, than we should rethink if Kenyans indeed are more talented for distance running than Nigerians. One doing so is completely irrelevant for the question.
Eh? Presumably you're trying to say that it's not as clear cut that Kenya's doping problem is greater than most others. 150+ doping busts, when only very recently was testing there even of basic standard, suggests otherwise. WADA and the AIU also disagree.
No it's not irrelevant. It's a black swan that disproves your racist thesis that Kenyans and Nigerians are massively genetically distinct when it comes to 'talent'.
Do you find it a co-incidence that the two most genetically gifted ethnic groups in the world (supposedly) live in the same part of East Africa - Ethiopians and Kenyans - but are almost completely genetically unrelated? Do you suppose that Moroccans are genetically gifted when it comes to distance running? Genetically, they are almost indistinguishable from any other meditteranean group, including Italans and Spaniards.
BTW, do you believe Kenyans have a concept of time?
Jeezus, you are thick - and dishonest. Saying men and women are identical - which I didn't - means they cannot be either male or female, but exactly the same. I said they share a human physiology but it goes without saying they will have sexually defined differences. In terms of peds, these differences are irrelevant, as WADA makes no distinction between the sexes. Both sexes can - and do - dope using the same drugs.
Your point about missing tests is wilful blindness. As I said on another thread, for a top athlete to miss one test might be careless; to miss two is serious and they must realise they cannot miss another without jeopardizing their career and reputation. To miss the third can only be explained by one of two alternatives: they are evading testers because they are doping - which is why WADA treats a three times whereabouts failure as a doping violation - or they are so simple-minded they haven't understood their obligations. That is not an elite or professional athlete. No one suggests that of Manangoi.
On your last point about training, a violation does not prevent an athlete from doing that - as we see with Houlihan. Manangoi may not be expected to be as sharp as when he was regularly competing but his fall-off is so precipitous he is simply not the same athlete. The reason is obvious.
I knew it wouldn't take long for you to call me "thick" after I asked "how thick are you". I think all your insults are just recycled insults you have received over time.
But like all things, you are wrong again -- I am neither thick nor dishonest. Funny how you claim you said something, and next thing you say is "it goes without saying". Anyone interested can scroll back see what you said in response to what. We've gone all over the map because you couldn't ever establish the doping benefit for men in middle distance, resorting first to the "presence" of doping, and then to one example of a woman in 800m, not to mention baseball, sprinting, weightlifting, and cycling and chess and darts and marathoning.
It frankly doesn't matter what you said in another thread -- like this thread, most things you say are nonsense. It is just you painting a cartoon picture with false choices of what you think the world looks like from your vantage point on a little island at the bottom of the world. Manangoi had three whereabouts failures -- not much to infer from that, except that he missed some unscheduled appointments.
The reason for Manangoi's performance changes is obviously not doping, because it is not obvious that any doping would bring 10 seconds to the 1500m.
So Manangoi "missed some unscheduled appointments"? Really? "Appointments" have to be scheduled or they are not appointments. What he failed to do was make himself available at a time he had himself chosen when the testers called. He failed his obligations not once but 3 times. So is he a simpleton? Or a cheat? WADA didn't see his failure as trivially as you do; it earned him a a violation of the antidoping rules and a ban. Maybe in the future he will take his obligations more seriously. Of course you have no plausible explanation for why his performances are not within a country mile of what he was doing before his ban.
So Manangoi "missed some unscheduled appointments"? Really? "Appointments" have to be scheduled or they are not appointments. What he failed to do was make himself available at a time he had himself chosen when the testers called. He failed his obligations not once but 3 times. So is he a simpleton? Or a cheat? WADA didn't see his failure as trivially as you do; it earned him a a violation of the antidoping rules and a ban. Maybe in the future he will take his obligations more seriously. Of course you have no plausible explanation for why his performances are not within a country mile of what he was doing before his ban.
Three failures can happen. I don't say this is trivial, just that it is not doping.
My explanation for his drop is physical and mental, but obviously not doping since no one has or can establish that doping is worth 10 seconds.
So Manangoi "missed some unscheduled appointments"? Really? "Appointments" have to be scheduled or they are not appointments. What he failed to do was make himself available at a time he had himself chosen when the testers called. He failed his obligations not once but 3 times. So is he a simpleton? Or a cheat? WADA didn't see his failure as trivially as you do; it earned him a a violation of the antidoping rules and a ban. Maybe in the future he will take his obligations more seriously. Of course you have no plausible explanation for why his performances are not within a country mile of what he was doing before his ban.
Three failures can happen. I don't say this is trivial, just that it is not doping.
My explanation for his drop is physical and mental, but obviously not doping since no one has or can establish that doping is worth 10 seconds.
So Manangoi "missed some unscheduled appointments"? Really? "Appointments" have to be scheduled or they are not appointments. What he failed to do was make himself available at a time he had himself chosen when the testers called. He failed his obligations not once but 3 times. So is he a simpleton? Or a cheat? WADA didn't see his failure as trivially as you do; it earned him a a violation of the antidoping rules and a ban. Maybe in the future he will take his obligations more seriously. Of course you have no plausible explanation for why his performances are not within a country mile of what he was doing before his ban.
Three failures can happen. I don't say this is trivial, just that it is not doping.
My explanation for his drop is physical and mental, but obviously not doping since no one has or can establish that doping is worth 10 seconds.
So how do three failures, when he would be aware of their seriousness, just "happen"? He is either mentally incompetent (no one suggests that) or he was doping. Which is it?
It isn't "obviously not doping" since you don't know what improvements top athletes have made through doping. They don't tell you - or anyone - what they are doing.
Three failures can happen. I don't say this is trivial, just that it is not doping.
My explanation for his drop is physical and mental, but obviously not doping since no one has or can establish that doping is worth 10 seconds.
So how do three failures, when he would be aware of their seriousness, just "happen"? He is either mentally incompetent (no one suggests that) or he was doping. Which is it?
It isn't "obviously not doping" since you don't know what improvements top athletes have made through doping. They don't tell you - or anyone - what they are doing.
I guess his reasons are public, and anyone with competence could find them. Could be things like not updating whereabouts during a delayed flight, or stuck in traffic jam on the way home from work, or away in another country getting treated for an injury.
So how do three failures, when he would be aware of their seriousness, just "happen"? He is either mentally incompetent (no one suggests that) or he was doping. Which is it?
It isn't "obviously not doping" since you don't know what improvements top athletes have made through doping. They don't tell you - or anyone - what they are doing.
I guess his reasons are public, and anyone with competence could find them. Could be things like not updating whereabouts during a delayed flight, or stuck in traffic jam on the way home from work, or away in another country getting treated for an injury.
"Could be"? So you don't know. You left out not hearing the doorbell. And the dog ate his homework.
I guess his reasons are public, and anyone with competence could find them. Could be things like not updating whereabouts during a delayed flight, or stuck in traffic jam on the way home from work, or away in another country getting treated for an injury.
"Could be"? So you don't know. You left out not hearing the doorbell. And the dog ate his homework.
Wrong again. His reasons are public and I have sufficient competence to find them.
"Could be"? So you don't know. You left out not hearing the doorbell. And the dog ate his homework.
Wrong again. His reasons are public and I have sufficient competence to find them.
His reasons are public. They included getting stuck in a traffic jam at 4 am heading out of Nairobi to his training camp in rural Rongei.
With the historical traffic information online for just about anywhere on Earth, this forum could easily verify or refute this within 24 hours, but hounding to death a 50 year old marathon cheat is more their cup of tea.
Manangoi recently claimed that in the 3 years before his suspension, he earned millions of dollars from track. You'd think he would have been able to employ somebody to make sure this didn't happen.
Wrong again. His reasons are public and I have sufficient competence to find them.
His reasons are public. They included getting stuck in a traffic jam at 4 am heading out of Nairobi to his training camp in rural Rongei.
With the historical traffic information online for just about anywhere on Earth, this forum could easily verify or refute this within 24 hours, but hounding to death a 50 year old marathon cheat is more their cup of tea.
Manangoi recently claimed that in the 3 years before his suspension, he earned millions of dollars from track. You'd think he would have been able to employ somebody to make sure this didn't happen.
Since it is your cup of tea to hound Kenyans, but obviously not for racist reasons, why don't you demonstrate for us be example just how easy this internet search would be and try to find this traffic information and tell us what you found? I did google find that Nairobi is the 4th ranked city in the world for traffic congestion.
In the meantime, maybe you can tell us what would be the point?
Note after missing the second test, like you would think, he did employ somebody to make sure this didn't happen, and that somebody made a mistake entering travel dates into ADAMs.
I also note a strange circular contradiction between you and Armstronglivs. Armstronglivs draws for us a cartoon dichotomy of choosing between competence and doping, as if no other options existed. So we are confronted with this strange contradiction that if he was truly clean, and simply delayed by planes and automobiles, he must also be sophisticated enough and rich enough and tech saavy enough and competent enough to update his whereabouts. Therefore, the "logical" inference is that because he didn't, he must be avoiding the tests without notifying ADAMs, in order to hide his doping, while also not sophisticated and not tech saavy and not competent enough to update his whereabouts, which would help him better hide his doping. But because he is incompetent, then we can infer that he is clean? What if he was both competent and doping? A sophisticated doper, especially a millionaire who can delegate these things, could have easily just updated his whereabouts, before both the first and second missed tests, and completely avoided the whole affair. What if he was both negligent and not doping, and didn't think about updating his whereabouts during delays in travel and from traffic?
"Could be"? So you don't know. You left out not hearing the doorbell. And the dog ate his homework.
Wrong again. His reasons are public and I have sufficient competence to find them.
No you haven't. You just made a few up there. In any case, his "reasons" - whatever they were - weren't accepted by WADA. That means his failures to meet his testing obligations was because he was probably doping. WADA doesn't have to say that but that's why he earns a suspension. Athletes only have reason to duck testers because they are juicing.
"Traffic congestion" - spare me! (Maybe his watch had stopped? Or his mother called and he lost track of time? He needed to say he didn't hear the doorbell.) Every athlete could claim getting caught in traffic - or similar such BS -at some point. I'm not surprised WADA didn't buy it.