"Pandemic of the unvaccinated" CONFIRMED

So, back to a more balanced, middle-path assessment:

If you are a pro-vaxxer forcing young and/or otherwise healthy people to take the jab, the deaths and damage that result from that are on your hands. If you are an anti-vaxxer with multiple co-morbidities, the benefits of the jab probably outweigh the risks, and you need to either drastically clean up your health or take the jab. Probably the latter since it is likely you have put off being pro-active on your health for years or decades.

Preserve individual medical freedom, don't fall for the media's polarization tactics. Educate yourself on the risk/reward and proceed for your own best benefit

Harambe wrote:

263 COVID deaths per day last week in Florida.

In NY: 10.

Babble all you want, the numbers speak for themselves.

Not so fast Charlie. NY has more total deaths than Florida has (54,030 vs 44,561):

Florida's economy is also far better than NY. Unemployment rate is better (5.1 vs 7.6).

The economy is what counts now. You Democrats don't get that. Knock off all the fearmongering & authoritative behavior with the vaccines & focus on the economy!

Let freedom ring in Florida! 👍

A few things we know about vaccines and masks.

1. The vaccines work over a time span of months at a maximum level of 70-95% effectiveness in preventing disease.

2. The vaccines have been decreasingly effective over time, possibly falling below 50% or less after 4-8 months if you believe Israeli studies. It's unclear whether this is because they can't cope with new virus variants that arise, or simply that the immune system response to all variants declines over time.

3. Anecdotally (based largely on CDC data from a Provincetown, Massachusetts outbreak among vaccinated people), even vaccinated people will carry a sufficient viral load (after exposure to the delta variant) to be infectious to others.

4. There is conflicting information as to the utility of booster shots. The White House and CDC are recommending immediate implementation of boosters, but this is over the objections of scientists at the FDA - two of whom (a director and deputy director) resigned over the WH's politicization of its booster program. The European Union is not, at this time, recommending a program of booster shots. There is a social justice angle to opposition to a booster program in wealthy countries while billions of people in poor countries have not had access to vaccines at all. With respect to booster shots it's not clear any one on either side is following the science.

5. Israeli studies strongly show that natural immunity obtained by contracting the disease provides protection from infection that is far greater over time than the protection provided by the best vaccine. There is no gain to vaccinating people who have once been infected by the virus. This poses ethical obstacles to vaccine mandates that include those already infected by Covid, and especially to requirements for universal vaccine passports.

6. Studies on masks are in conflict, but a recent, apparently authoritative, study in Bangladesh showed a 5% reduction in disease among people wearing cloth masks, and and 11% reduction among people wearing N95 grade masks, both as compared with unmasked people (with, however, very broad confidence intervals about those numbers).

7. It's unclear whether or not mask wearing promotes riskier social behavior sufficient to offset the benefits of wearing the mask.

The Unkle wrote:

Yessiree Bob wrote:

Canceled.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2021/08/cam-newton-mac-jones-vaccine-career-patriots

Yep.

Do what we tell you or we will end you.

We must hang together or we will surely be hanged separately

The NFL and the other pro sports leagues are entirely driven by money and public relations. Whichever way the wind is blowing on a particular day dictates policy. They wish to be in the good graces of the government on vaccines, but are trying to have it both ways. Read the statement by Jacksonville management about Urban Meyer's comments.

Let's really tell it like it is wrote:

Harambe wrote:

263 COVID deaths per day last week in Florida.

In NY: 10.

Babble all you want, the numbers speak for themselves.

Not so fast Charlie. NY has more total deaths than Florida has (54,030 vs 44,561):

https://usafacts.org/visualizations/coronavirus-covid-19-spread-map/

Florida's economy is also far better than NY. Unemployment rate is better (5.1 vs 7.6).

The economy is what counts now. You Democrats don't get that. Knock off all the fearmongering & authoritative behavior with the vaccines & focus on the economy!

Let freedom ring in Florida! 👍

So? That mostly comes down to the timing of the pandemic. NY was hit hard and early while the US did not have any sort of response or serious public health guidelines in place to prevent exponential spread, especially in NY which has a population density 70x greater than Florida. That Florida and other southern states have sh!t the bed in response (at least in generally low vax rates) to the recent COVID surge is inescapable now.

Let's really tell it like it is wrote:

Not so fast Charlie. NY has more total deaths than Florida has (54,030 vs 44,561):

https://usafacts.org/visualizations/coronavirus-covid-19-spread-map/

Florida's economy is also far better than NY. Unemployment rate is better (5.1 vs 7.6).

The economy is what counts now. You Democrats don't get that. Knock off all the fearmongering & authoritative behavior with the vaccines & focus on the economy!

Let freedom ring in Florida! 👍

Apparently, the mobile morgue industry in Florida is booming, so there's that!

fixed Covid wrote:

Look everyone, Harambe doubling down on Biden fixed COVID, then calling others "fear mongers", then uh..awkwardly fear mongering (his forte').

You are a hack and a serial projector Harambe.

I didn't fearmonger. The antivaxxers are the ones filling up ICUs. That's a simple fact.

2) The vaccine's protection against severe disease has not waned one bit, importantly

3) Importantly, vaccinated people are infected significantly less (>7X) and clear the infection faster, so they are less transmissible.

4) I agree booster shots are unnecessary for all but the most vulnerable, and even they are still well protected against severe disease.

5) The Israeli study and others (CDC in KY, for example) actually showed a significant improvement in immune response from vaccinating prior infected people. If our goal is limiting transmission, infection + vaccine makes people VERY immune and unlikely to spread, so it makes sense to vaccinate them!

6-7) The Bangladesh study tested this as well, as they were just looking at communities with mask wearing encouraged or without.

Let's really tell it like it is wrote:

Harambe wrote:

263 COVID deaths per day last week in Florida.

In NY: 10.

Babble all you want, the numbers speak for themselves.

Not so fast Charlie. NY has more total deaths than Florida has (54,030 vs 44,561):

https://usafacts.org/visualizations/coronavirus-covid-19-spread-map/

Florida's economy is also far better than NY. Unemployment rate is better (5.1 vs 7.6).

The economy is what counts now. You Democrats don't get that. Knock off all the fearmongering & authoritative behavior with the vaccines & focus on the economy!

Let freedom ring in Florida! 👍

They are deliberately understating the number of deaths among the vaccinated in order to continue the narrative that vaccines are "safe and effective". 68% of the over 12 population of Florida is vaccinated. 87% of the 65+ population in Florida is vaccinated. That isn't that much different than NY (72% over 18, about 89% over 65), so Harambe attributing the large differential solely to vaccination status is complete bogus, and refuses to acknowledge the seasonal fluctuations, different age demographics and the higher degree of naturally acquired immunity in New York state. The effectiveness of vaccination is overstated. Hopefully, this is the last surge in cases and deaths due to accelerated transmission from the ending of mask mandates (deaths are about 20% higher than the same time last year in spite of the fact that 62% of the US is at least partially vaccinated), if not, the winter is going to be absolutely horrific

Uprising wrote:

This is your response for a decently nuanced, measured and balanced suggestion on the topic? You are triggered this much by rational discourse?

Thank you for at least demonstrating clearly your uncompromisingly fascistic belief that you are right, the science is wrong, there is no risk to vaccines whatsoever (21K confirmed recent vaxx deaths in the EU alone notwithstanding) and that authoritarian forced measures are the only option to save every last possible hospital bed. Above all you are, in your mentally ill foaming-at-the-keyboard default, calling every last person opting out based on their own situation as a "sociopathic killer".

Sounds like jealousy on your part for the last bit.

That is another big **YAWN** for the dead-gorilla fist-pounding shills and their aspirant sycophants.

There are a handful of confirmed vaccine deaths, far outweighed by the damage antivaxxers are doing (and COVID itself is doing). 21k is comically unsupported and shows that you are not thinking rationally.

Hospital load would be maybe 15% of what it is now, probably less, was everyone in the US vaccinated.

Instead, antivaxxers are committed to dying and taking as many people with them.

Or it's that NY has 25 cases/100k and FL has 95/100k.

Now why does FL have more cases? Seroprevalence would have to be doing A LOT of work in NY for your hand-waving to hold up.

joed|rt wrote:

They are deliberately understating the number of deaths among the vaccinated in order to continue the narrative that vaccines are "safe and effective". 68% of the over 12 population of Florida is vaccinated. 87% of the 65+ population in Florida is vaccinated. That isn't that much different than NY (72% over 18, about 89% over 65), so Harambe attributing the large differential solely to vaccination status is complete bogus, and refuses to acknowledge the seasonal fluctuations, different age demographics and the higher degree of naturally acquired immunity in New York state. The effectiveness of vaccination is overstated. Hopefully, this is the last surge in cases and deaths due to accelerated transmission from the ending of mask mandates (deaths are about 20% higher than the same time last year in spite of the fact that 62% of the US is at least partially vaccinated), if not, the winter is going to be absolutely horrific

Nothing you posted has anything to do with the effectiveness of vaccination. The vaccines are very effective in Florida and will remain so:

Delta is just so transmissible that moron antivaxxers can't hide behind herd immunity.

The antivaxxers in New York are just as vulnerable to a wave there as well, and no less moronic.

I am not the one who made the idiotic comparison to NY, just the one laughing at at.

troll 69 wrote:

So? That mostly comes down to the timing of the pandemic. NY was hit hard and early while the US did not have any sort of response or serious public health guidelines in place to prevent exponential spread, especially in NY which has a population density 70x greater than Florida. That Florida and other southern states have sh!t the bed in response (at least in generally low vax rates) to the recent COVID surge is inescapable now.

Rofl yeah, imagine you got a 18 month in adnance warning about COVID and you still punted thousands of your population when the wave came.

How dumb can the antivaxxers and the government be in Florida?

Kids are at far greater risk from the vaccines than from Covid.

Not even close

When the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) since November 1984 and the leading architect of “agency capture”—the corporate seizure of America’s public health agencies by the pharmaceutical industry—happen to be the same man, conflicts of interest arise. Wearing both hats, Dr. Anthony Stephen Fauci, tasked with managing the COVID-19 pandemic in the US, peddled and back-pedaled his prescriptions as Pharma profits and bureaucratic powers grew and public health waned.

Working in tandem with his long-term partner, billionaire Bill Gates, to corral Americans toward a single vaccine solution to COVID, Dr. Fauci committed zero dollars to studying or promoting early treatment with various drug combinations that could dramatically reduce deaths and hospitalizations. Meanwhile, in an assault on our First Amendment guarantee of free speech, Dr. Fauci’s Silicon Valley and media allies dutifully censored criticism of his policies on mainstream social media and collaborated to muzzle any medical information about therapies and treatments that might end the pandemic and compete with vaccines.

After effectively abolishing the First Amendment right to free speech, Dr. Fauci subverted our Seventh Amendment rights to jury trials by arranging to shield reckless and negligent pharmaceutical corporations from liability for injuries from any COVID countermeasures, including vaccines. His lockdowns targeted First Amendment religious freedom by closing churches—while keeping liquor stores open as “essential businesses”—and abolishing century-old religious exemptions to vaccination. Dr. Fauci’s enforced quarantine trampled the Constitutional rights of assembly, of association, and to petition the government, and our Fifth Amendment protection against uncompensated taking of private property. His arbitrary mask and lockdown diktats, without public hearings or rulemaking, strangled our Fourth and Fourteenth Amendment due process guarantees. His tracking and tracing initiatives bulldozed Constitutional rights to privacy and travel, and our Fourth Amendment protections against warrantless searches and seizures.

Finally, readers will see how Dr. Fauci and Bill Gates, asserting biosecurity rationales, worked together to finance and promote the very gain-of-function experiments in Wuhan that may have released the COVID-19 pathogen.

The Unkle wrote:

Kids are at far greater risk from the vaccines than from Covid.

Not even close

Proof?

Harambe wrote:

troll 69 wrote:

So? That mostly comes down to the timing of the pandemic. NY was hit hard and early while the US did not have any sort of response or serious public health guidelines in place to prevent exponential spread, especially in NY which has a population density 70x greater than Florida. That Florida and other southern states have sh!t the bed in response (at least in generally low vax rates) to the recent COVID surge is inescapable now.

Rofl yeah, imagine you got a 18 month in adnance warning about COVID and you still punted thousands of your population when the wave came.

How dumb can the antivaxxers and the government be in Florida?

They were instrumental to DeathSantis' governorship. The answer clearly is that there is no limit

“Despite these risks, both research teams continue to advocate for COVID-19 vaccines as the health risks from the virus are far greater than those linked to the vaccine.”