Definition of: Mediocre, Decent, Good, Sub-Elite, and Elite in High School

studboye wrote:

What are the distance (800, 3200, 1600) cutoffs for being considered: Mediocre, Decent, Good, Sub-Elite, and Elite etc. in High School

Boys girls

800

2:06 2:33

2:02 2:25

1:59 2:22

1:56 2:19

1:52 2:15

1:49 2:10

Boys girls

1600

5:00 5:50

4:45 5:35

4:30 5:22

4:20 5:10

4:15 5:00

4:08 4:49

Boys girls

3200

11:00 13:00

10:30 12:00

10:00 11:30

9:30 11:00

9:10 10:40

8:50 10:00

Boys girls

5000

18:40 21:00

17:20 20:30

16:25 19:30

16:00 18:45

15:20 18:00

14:30 17:00ish this one is the hardest one for me

Same as most lists but with some context and extra national class category

Mediocre= Top half of slow heat at local invite

2:06 5:00 11:00

Decent= Conference/County Scorer

2:02 4:40 10:20

Good= Conference/County Top 3

Quality DIII Development Recruit

1:58 4:25 9:50

Sub-Elite= State Final Fast Heat Finalist

DI Walkon/ Quality DIII Target Recruit

1:56 4:20 9:30

Elite- State Final Top 3

D1 Scholarship Entry Level

1:53 4:12 9:05

National Meet Invitee-

D1 Full Ride Potential

1:49 4:08 8:55

This is the only person who's ever been to an average high school meet.

159418928 wrote:

Same as most lists but with some context and extra national class category

Mediocre= Top half of slow heat at local invite

2:06 5:00 11:00

Decent= Conference/County Scorer

2:02 4:40 10:20

Good= Conference/County Top 3

Quality DIII Development Recruit

1:58 4:25 9:50

Sub-Elite= State Final Fast Heat Finalist

DI Walkon/ Quality DIII Target Recruit

1:56 4:20 9:30

Elite- State Final Top 3

D1 Scholarship Entry Level

1:53 4:12 9:05

National Meet Invitee-

D1 Full Ride Potential

1:49 4:08 8:55

By that rationale, only 9 milers, 19 2 milers, and 3 800m runners in the entire United States had the potential to get a D1 full ride last year.

California Boys 1600

Top .1% - 4:13.79

Top 1% - 4:22.56

Top 10% - 4:40.76

Top 25% - 4:55.16

Top 50% - 5:14.45

CA HS Girls

Top .1% 4:51.73

Top 1% 5:03.72

Top 10% 5:32.22

Top 25% 5:51.58

Top 50% 6:18.05

CoachB wrote:

California HS boys 800m 12945 recorded times (all official FAT)

Top .1% (13th on list) 1:53.80

Top 1% (130 on list) 1:57.38

Top 10% (1300 on list) 2:05.70

Top 25% (3250 on list) 2:12.73

Top 50% (6500 on list) 2:21.78

If anything these times might skew a little bit high. Since they are all FAT times, they will not include the kids that coach throws in an 800 in a dual meet for workout purposes, but otherwise would never run that event.

This was a pain in the butt. Athletic.net only loads 100 results per page. I'm not doing all the events.

Don't do any more events. This does not tell anyone anything. 1:53.80 is great, but would only be the elite level in CA by itself. 1:53 would be sub-elite for the nation, in other words, you would be just below making a National final. I would imagine that there are thousands of other marks that don't get recorded, so these percentiles don't correlate to anything.

2:21 is not mediocre, 2:21 is a time for a slow freshman.

So, what is considered Elite? Top 001%? What is mediocre? Median has the same root as mediocre, so they've got to be close. Have you ever considered that your experience has been skewed to the fast side?

All the big meets where kids are popping fast times are on athletic.net in CA, so I'm not leaving any studs off the list. The kid who runs 2:45 in a jv dual meet has a greater chance of being left off the list.

Perhaps California is just a slow state.....but we know that's not the truth either.

I used to run faster wrote:

I listed eleven levels. The top level has created some interest. Is the top level incorrect? 2012 Olympics, men 800m final, a few teenagers raced well that day. I am sure it is possible teenage females may race at a very elite level in an Olympic 800m final. We have seen teenage females race 400m in 52 seconds. Why is it out of the question for a teenage female to average 57.45 per lap for 800m?

There were zero teens in the men's 800 final in 2012, just guys who claimed to be teens. Aman's own agent has said that the former WC was 23 or so in 2012, and DJ Zoro (Amos) was apparently 22 as HIS AGENT has said. The third "teen" was a Kenyan...well, most Kenyan teen phenoms are not teens. Some are legit, like Kiprop when he first showed up. But most are not.

I used to run faster wrote:

I listed eleven levels. The top level has created some interest. Is the top level incorrect? 2012 Olympics, men 800m final, a few teenagers raced well that day. I am sure it is possible teenage females may race at a very elite level in an Olympic 800m final. We have seen teenage females race 400m in 52 seconds. Why is it out of the question for a teenage female to average 57.45 per lap for 800m?

If the teen female in question eats tainted meat like some American hot shot in her 20's, maybe we'll see a 1:55 high schooler. Ask Johnny Gray, he's rather clear headed on this subject and knows a thing or two about the 800.

Moran found.

If we re-defined the percentages to those only including "Varsity" runners, the numbers would look a lot different. However, I've been coaching for a long time and see plenty of kids in "Varsity" races running times well slower than those listed as Mediocre by the 50th percentile Standard.

3200 CA Boys

Top .1% 9:03.40

Top 1% 9:22.59

Top 10% 10:05.72

Top 25% 10:39.43

Top 50% 11:21.53

3200 CA Girls

Top .1% 10:20.92

Top 1% 10:51.01

Top 10% 11:51.61

Top 25% 12:37.47

Top 50% 13:33.03

There were 355 boys in California alone who ran under 2 minutes in the 800 last spring. There is no such thing as an elite at the high school level in any sport.

High school is the beginning. Jim Ryun peaked at age 21, yet many have gone on to win in the Olympics in their late 30s. It's best to be patient!!!

Elites? Surely you jest. How do you think a 1:49 high school boy is going to do against the elites?

What a joke. High school is the beginning it's time America started to realize that and start teaching and developing our kids rather than just using them up by the time they are 21!!!