ConnorsBoy wrote:
I can promise you that none of the people on this thread are Tinman, his parents, or Hunter himself.
You can only KNOW that for sure if you're one of them, and guess which one.
ConnorsBoy wrote:
I can promise you that none of the people on this thread are Tinman, his parents, or Hunter himself.
You can only KNOW that for sure if you're one of them, and guess which one.
Seyta wrote:
The feed at FL died in the race, and that left anyone who wasn't actually there unable to see what was going on.
Footlocker posted the entire feed soon after the race was over, so everyone has been able to see it.
Also, I think Hunter will definitely break 4:55.
Yeah...no
First I'll admit I'm an idiot. The one thing I do like is Andy Powell with Hunter. Outside of that, not sure I see the reasoning of this all out push to run insane times outdoor..and indoor. Its just he is in HS, if he gets hurt then what do you say. I am a bit suspicious that these goal times are the plan of Andy Powell. Maybe I'm wrong, just don't want anything happening to Hunter at all! Got a bad feeling of this push for 3:55 and 8:20's, in HS. Sounds like day in and day out push for the next 7 months!?
What makes you think it would be a day in, day out push? If Fisher goes 3:55/7:57 this year, why shouldn't Hunter?
He was phenomenal last year without maxing out his training. He hasn't gotten injured and has progressed ever so slightly in fitness. A 5-6 sec drop in the mile and 13-15 second drop in the 2 mile is not unrealistic.
Would you say a kid hoping to go from 4:20 down to 4:14 in the mile was trying to hard for a high schooler?
Not sure what race you were watching, but his race strategy DID lead to the win, a fast time, and a significant margin of victory; hence, it was effective. Could he have run even faster if he had paced it more evenly or been pushed? Maybe so.
And how you can say his downhill was "out of control" is beyond me. Good quick turnover, good body position. Definitely better than last year's downhill running where he was leaning back and braking the whole way down.
Interesting stuff wrote:
dipset wrote:This is idiocy. Pure idiocy. You, sir, need to stop sucking this young man's **** and understand exactly how good 3:55 is. He might break 4. Might. He won't approach 3:55.
Meh, I could see him running 3:56.high - 3:57... He really is that good. We saw 2 sub 4 miles last year and he's running better than they were at this point.
If he gets under 150, 357 follows.
NoNameXCfan wrote:
blah blah
How he ran is like an 8:40 two mile going out in 57 the first lap against 9:00 runners, and winning in 8:56 -- yeah he won, but the way he ran the race was retarded. The way he ran the downhill was like running out in lane 8 on the curves.
Okay, but he won, so that must be the best strategy, according to you anyway.
NoNameXCfan wrote:
how you can say his downhill was "out of control" is beyond me. Good quick turnover, good body position. Definitely better than last year's downhill running where he was leaning back and braking the whole way down.
LIke this his-downhill-was-out-of control.
He even admitted in his post race interview that his plan was to "surge the downhills" and he was definitely pounding & braking, not running smoothly going down them - watch the video.
Lets look at some numbers:
-8:43 with a monster last lap in track; so sub-8:40 shape with pacers/pros.
-improves by 19 seconds the following cross season
Look for a sub-8:30 in a pro race in outdoor. Or a 7:55 indoor.
Yes, I think he can go sub 4 but maybe only in an elite race or with college guys. 3:58 - 3:59'ish. 2 Mile same thing. 8:40's definitely but unless he's pushed by other HS'ers or pulled along by college/elite runners, he'll only stay in that zone and not go below 8:40. That's not to say he cant do an 8:30's performance in the Spring, but let's hope he doesn't 'freak peak' too soon and burn out or get injured.
All this stuff about what a high schooler will do is wasted oxygen.
Its far better to discuss what he did.
Lenny Leonard wrote:
What makes you think it would be a day in, day out push? If Fisher goes 3:55/7:57 this year, why shouldn't Hunter?
He was phenomenal last year without maxing out his training. He hasn't gotten injured and has progressed ever so slightly in fitness. A 5-6 sec drop in the mile and 13-15 second drop in the 2 mile is not unrealistic.
Would you say a kid hoping to go from 4:20 down to 4:14 in the mile was trying to hard for a high schooler?
I don't know a HS guy dropping from 4:20 to 4:14 is little different story IMHO. To chase 3:55 as a HS guy is a bit different world don't you think? His coach said it is gonna be a constant push. I mean the dream mile win and to hit 4:00 seems huge to me. This same type thread came up in 2007 over German. I'm just saying I got a bad feeling. Hope I'm so freakin wrong believe me. That's why I am......IDIOTHERE!
Hardly pointing out the obvious: that workout took place roughly six years ago and I was citing it from memory. However, you are right that he ran a 4:15, not a 4:18 for his last interval (finish at about 8:00 here:
http://www.flotrack.org/video/78340-oklahoma-state-workout-with-the-cowboys-episode-7
)
But Drew ran solo and he finished 2 seconds faster than GF in the year of his 3:55. The point stands.
From these lists, the only guys to run faster at both 2M and 1M than Drew Hunter so far are Gerry Lindgren, Lukas Verzbicas, and maybe GF 1600converted. Plus, if you pair Matt Centrowitz pere et fils. That's already an all-time great.
some of the miles here are converted and a few 4:02s, including Hunter's, are missing.
3:53.43 Alan Webb (South Lakes, Reston, Virginia) 2001
3:55.3 Jim Ryun (East, Wichita, Kansas) 1965
3:56.8 ————Ryun 1965
3:58.1 ————Ryun 1965
3:58.3 ————Ryun 1965
3:59.0 ————*Ryun 1964
3:59.38 Matthew Maton (Summit, Bend, Oregon) 2015
3:59.38 Grant Fisher (Grand Blanc, Michigan) 2015
3:59.4 Tim Danielson (Chula Vista, California) 1966
3:59.71 *Lukas Verzbicas’ (Sandburg, Orland Park, Illinois) 2011
**10 performances by 6 performers**
3:59.8 Marty Liquori (Essex Catholic, Newark, New Jersey) 1967
4:00.29 Donald Sage (York, Elmhurst, Illinois) 2000
4:00.52+ Ryan Hall, Big Bear, Big Bear Lake (03:42.70 1.5k) CA '01
4:01.02 Steve Magness (Klein Oak, Houston, Texas) 2003
4:01.03+ Jon Riley, Brookline, (03:43.18 1.5k) MA '97
4:01.09 Rob Finnerty (Burnsville, Minnesota) 2008
6 6
4:01.27+ Matt Centrowitz, Power Memorial, NYC (03:43.4 1.5k) NY '73
4:01.5 Gerry Lindgren, Rogers, Spokane WA '64
4:02.01 Sharif Karie, West, West Springfield VA '97
4:02.4 Rich Kimball, De La Salle HS, CA '74
4:02.57+ Vince Draddy, Iona Prep, New Rochelle (03:44.6 1.5k) NY '79
4:02.70ci Thom Hunt, Henry, San Diego CA '76
4:02.7 Andy Powell, Oliver, Ames MA '99
4:02.81 Gabe Jennings, Madison, E Madison WI '97
2 MILES
8:29.46 *Lukas Verzbicas’ (Sandburg, Orland Park, Illinois) 2011
8:34.40 German Fernandez (Riverbank, California) 2008
8:36.3 Jeff Nelson (Burbank, California) 1979
8:37.22+ ————Fernandez 2008
8:39.15i Edward Cheserek’ (St. Benedict’s, Newark, New Jersey) 2013
8:40.0i Gerry Lindgren (Rogers, Spokane, Washington) 1964
8:40.70i ————*Verzbicas’ 2011
8:40.9 Craig Virgin (Lebanon, Illinois) 1973
8:41.55 Matthew Centrowitz (Broadneck, Annapolis, Maryland) 2007
8:41.5 Steve Prefontaine (Marshfield, Coos Bay, Oregon) 1969
**10 performances by 8 performers**
8:42.51 *Andrew Hunter (Loudoun Valley, Purcellville, Virginia) 2015
I could definitely see him run a 2 mile/3200 in the 8:30ish range, but I doubt he's gonna be running 3:55 as a high school...he's gonna need a LOT more speed endurance than he has ever had. Think about the fact that a 3:55 mile equates to around 3:38 for 1500. I honestly don't see him running that fast this year, but I'd say a 3:58 mile is realistic (which equates to around 3:41 for 1500). Fischer ran 3:42 and 3:59 and was at the same mile time his junior year as Hunter was (4:02). I mean, I could see Hunter running a bit faster than 3:59, but not by too much. I'm thinking 3:57 at the fastest, but most likely 3:58.
Can't get the video to work, but I assume you're talking about the workout on the OSU cross country course? Did Hunter run it on the OSU course too? If so, you're right, that means something.Also, you'd think that someone training at that pace wouldn't run any portion of a 5K race at 5:00/mile pace would you? Especially 2/3 of the race.German ran 3:55i solo and a 7:47i 3K (going out in like 4:16) that indoor season. What's 7:47, about 8:23-:24 for 2 miles? He went on to run 13:25 for 5K that spring.
jjjjjjj wrote:
Hardly pointing out the obvious: that workout took place roughly six years ago and I was citing it from memory. However, you are right that he ran a 4:15, not a 4:18 for his last interval (finish at about 8:00 here:
http://www.flotrack.org/video/78340-oklahoma-state-workout-with-the-cowboys-episode-7)
But Drew ran solo and he finished 2 seconds faster than GF in the year of his 3:55. The point stands.
Lenny Leonard wrote:
He was phenomenal last year without maxing out his training. He hasn't gotten injured and has progressed ever so slightly in fitness. A 5-6 sec drop in the mile and 13-15 second drop in the 2 mile is not unrealistic.
Would you say a kid hoping to go from 4:20 down to 4:14 in the mile was trying to hard for a high schooler?
Exactly. Looking for Pat Casey to get down to 3:46 this year.