poiop909 wrote:
Carl tested positive for nothing of any value, things that aren't even banned today. The three drug tests were from the same herbal supplement that gives no advantage which is why it is legal now.
Lewis tested positive for the stimulants pseudoephedrine, ephedrine, and phenylpropanolamine; all of which are on the banned list today.
As well as having some stimulant effect they also have a masking effect.
Where did it all go wrong? Carl should have been a multi-millionnaire. He could have been the athlete Usain is now, except he was lacking one thing ... charisma
Lydiard is God wrote:
Jampop2 wrote:That's ignorant on your behalf. In 04 bolt ruptured his hamstring, and had recurrent hamstring/back related issues for the next few years until medical staff fixed the issue. I watched bolt run first hand at the age of 15 when I ran at the world juniors in Kingston. He had never stepped foot in a gym, was skinny as a stick and ran 20.6. The guy was the biggest prodigy in history, a genetic freak. His form was atrocious, absolutely terrible and he still crushed the field at 15. Contrary to your jealously all facts point towards bolt being clean.
The 'brilliant as a teen' argument wears a bit thin. Lots of kids are exceptional as youngsters. Very few go on with it. Only a handful become genuinely world-class. It's not so much Bolt's actual times, but how he does it with consumate ease, indeed, arrogance. Cue Makloufi in the 1500m and ? Rudisha in the 800m. The fact the latter does it multiple times in a season, and all kicked ass after rounds is also suspicious. Damn fine recoveries, wouldn't you say?
He improved .75 from 17-23. At the age of 17 his form was terrible, he didn't do weights and most importantly was a kid. You will struggle to find many who have improved less than .75 from 17-23 in the sprints. I've been training athletics seriously from a young age and my 200m improved from 22.78 to 21.19 from 17 to 25. There isn't any factual evidence to suggest drugs other than inherant bias whether that's racial bias I don't know...
In the documentary about the Seoul race between Johnson and Lewis, there was an interview with Lewis after the Rome world champs in '87 where he stated that drug users won medals. The irony was that Carl had braces on his teeth! By chance for HGH?
pr100 wrote:
poiop909 wrote:Carl tested positive for nothing of any value, things that aren't even banned today. The three drug tests were from the same herbal supplement that gives no advantage which is why it is legal now.
Lewis tested positive for the stimulants pseudoephedrine, ephedrine, and phenylpropanolamine; all of which are on the banned list today.
As well as having some stimulant effect they also have a masking effect.
"Ditto, in 1981. Frank is the man."
Ah ah ah! Dave Scott is "the man".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Scott_
(triathlete)
Carl Lewis had better sprinting form than Bolt. Despite that -- Bolt's track antics get a little silly after awhile. Plus Carl Lewis had the better hairstyle - too bad Lewis didn't do the lopsided thang with his crew cut afro you know that Bobby Brown look.
There's a difference between making baseless accusations on a message board and making them as a public figure. Carl Lewis has no evidence whatsoever. He should keep his mouth shut - especially given his questionable past.
I suppose you're right. This is the first time I've heard of the accusation...Carl should be thankful for what he's got and just be humble. Silence is golden, ya know:|
Reminds me of LeMond making accusations toward Lance when he was riding.
Pot meet Kettle.
pr100 wrote:
poiop909 wrote:Carl tested positive for nothing of any value, things that aren't even banned today. The three drug tests were from the same herbal supplement that gives no advantage which is why it is legal now.
Lewis tested positive for the stimulants pseudoephedrine, ephedrine, and phenylpropanolamine; all of which are on the banned list today.
As well as having some stimulant effect they also have a masking effect.
Ironic and hypocritical. The loudest accusers of Jamaican doping are from the USA, where rampant doping almost destroyed T&F (no wonder they are so traumatised). The Jamaicans ripped them new ones back in 08' and were tested like hell. Four years later, their samples are still clean.
Today, Gatlin, a convicted doper, is the best thing the USA has running, yet he has been handed his ass by Usain Bolt. Gatlin, the face of USA track & field! And Jamaica is being accused??? The situation is laughable.
Even if the Jamaicans were on some new form of undetectable drugs (undetectable since 08', mind you), that would mean the rest of the world are on the same drugs. So, WHY is a nation of 3 million still beating the countries that would have created these drugs and how did they manage to sweep?
Dig deep and you will find the answer, losers.
Wasn't Carl Lewis a drug cheat?
Oh!!!!!! slave yankee carl lewis how dear you put such moron suggetion abut the brilian Jamaican.
when america score 10000m silver and 1500m silve, it is simply beacuse it is hard working and scientific training but when they collect only bronze from 100-200 meter man, could not make it for 400m final their oppnets are Dopper. f**k america.
Here's the video of Bolt at 15: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmHLHZdnsNs
[quote]dsafd wrote:
You mean the same way the SMTC used to dominate all the sprints?
Well, SMTC represented US and foreign athletes, an athlete pool of about 300+ million athletes. Was there doping going on with SMTC? Probably. But to compare a track club with a population base of 300 million to a country of 3 million is laughable.
We have 100 times more athletes than they do, and we do a fine job of developing our own sprint talent as it is, so to have a tiny country of 3 million people suddenly OWN the 100/200 in a show of depth and dominance even the US has a hard time displaying, is suspicious. To deny that is folly. Hell, even when the women of the 1 billion population China were ripping up distance records on 'turtle soup', people knew something was up. That's from a country that has 1 billion possible athletes, not 3 million.
The best analog is Lydiard's 800/1500 successes from tiny New Zealand. I think we know why Lydiard was successful - he revolutionized training, and his guys were doing things that no one else was doing at the time.
I also believe that Jamaicans are doing something that no one else is doing right now - they've found a magic doping regimen. Victor Conte basically said that they've improved on his techniques.
If SMTC were dopers, then Jamaica must be the doping superpower.
That said, if everyone were clean, would Bolt still be the best? Yeah, probably.
He should have quoted Lewis on Romney:
Some Americans should never leave the country
break it up wrote:
Nonetheless he reminds me of Frank Shorter who feels bitter that the world of track evolves. Or Bob Schul who thinks he could have run 13:08 on a mondo track.
I had this conversation with Bob on a number of different occasions. There was no bitterness in his point at all. It was a discussion about how you could compare different runners who dealt with different conditions. It was a great post-workout conversation over beer and pizza. If you notice, he didn't say that he would be the best in the world. Bob has fully acknowledged that runners are better trained and there is a much larger pool to draw from now. His comments are very different from Carl's inability to accept that someone is faster than he was.
yikes!!! wrote:
That said, if everyone were clean, would Bolt still be the best? Yeah, probably.
If not for Bolt, things would be a bit different don't you think? If not for Bolt, Jamaica would have 100m silver and a convicted USA doper would have gold, righ? So with a clean Bolt, Jamaica would still dominate.
Nuff said.
pr100 wrote:
poiop909 wrote:Carl tested positive for nothing of any value, things that aren't even banned today. The three drug tests were from the same herbal supplement that gives no advantage which is why it is legal now.
Lewis tested positive for the stimulants pseudoephedrine, ephedrine, and phenylpropanolamine; all of which are on the banned list today.
As well as having some stimulant effect they also have a masking effect.
These are banned substances? I did not know that. These are merely your over the counter decongestants, taken for allergies and colds. They have about as much stimulant effect as black coffee or a chocolate bunny.
Let's all juice up and see how fast we can go. There's too much energy being wasted worrying about it.
hbjg wrote:
Speculate all you want about drug use in sports today, I certainly do. But the fact is that Carl Lewis failed 3 drug tests and Usain Bolt has failed none.
Exactly