Does the average guy have a chance?

Reg wrote:

WTF? are you insulting her or flirting with her?

Neither. I'm just saying it's clear to me from her post that she's a classy person. Kind of unusual to find here.[/quote]

Hey, I'm a classy person. I can eat frois gras and escargot with the best of 'em.

To the OP: the average guy has no chance with an average girl.

Translation: Stuck, you don't stand a chance.

Carry on

the most successful relationships are intelligent people do not have a spark, sparks make things complicated and cloud your mind.

A couple things:

1. You can improve your looks. I don't know what you dress like, but the right clothes and haircut can make an average person look a lot better.

2. The nervousness is killing you. Girls want a guy who is confident. Funny is a plus. I would recommend striking up as many conversations as possible with women in your day to day life as practice. This way when you are on a date you are used to talking to women and not nervous.

3. Always do drinks on a first date.

I thought it was going to be about how the average guy does (or does not) have a chance to run a 15min 5K or something like that. But of course I was wrong, this is not letsdate.com, this is letsrun.com

I read your email and think to myself maybe you are trying a little hard on the first date. Each failed date should get you ready for the next date so you don't make the same mistakes.

The key to dating is picking a female in your "zone". If you are an average looking guy, don't shoot for the best looking girl in the room. Give up a pretty face for anice body, so basically lower your standards. If the chick is divorced with a kid, your good job might be more appealing then to a single sucessful girl.

I say keep working the room and your will find your princess.....

The so called 'spark' women talk about is just your ability to create an atmosphere that is fun. The fun = flirty behaviour. Tease her make her laugh ramp things up sexually (don't pounce on her but be provocative when the time is right.) Don't be needy stay in control keep her wanting more. Always remember you create the spark not her!

erhr wrote:

Try having your first "date" be a lunch. Takes a lot of the pressure off you both.

And come visit NYC sometime, or just relocate here. Man, if I could get action here, *anybody* can.

I think even lunch is too much. Meet for coffee or a glass of wine. If it's not going well, get out quick. If it's going well, get out quick also. Always leave them wanting more. On the first date, try to make a small connection and split. Don't call for at least 3 day and go out on a very casual date - lunch or an event. It's important to go to places that you will meet women with similar interests. I love wine and met my wife at a wine tasting. Good luck.

yea you wrote:

I live in Baltimore. Come out one night with me. I'll show you how it's done and you'll meet tons of girls. serious post.

This is why the LRC is cool, a lot of people are willing to help other runners out, even on non-running related issues.

And as for creating a spark and such that some people have pointed out, I was hoping to maybe go on a couple dates and see what develops. But it looks like I need to be a little better on my first impressions.

Sorry, you don't have a chance.

Why is it that girls just get to sit back and judge us on our performance?

Are we funny enough? Did we create that spark? Did we make it fun? Do we tease and flirt?

Shouldn't the girl also need to prove her charm, grace, conversational prowess, etc...in addition to just sprucing up her looks on date night?

Nervousness is bad: WRONG!!!! Nervousness is a good thing, especially when both parties have it. That means both people are not sure if the other person likes them. That's what causes a spark. If you really like her, play hard to get. It will make her think about you more and wonder if you're into her or not. Read the 'Art of Seduction' - messed up book but a good read.

F*CK YOU

How much cash you got?

'The meat-market vibe is horrible and most of the girls are sluts. '

So you could never get anywhere with them but they are sluts

Maybe you are not as good looking as you think?

The advice about joining some club is good. I joined a hiking club and you would do much better than in a bar. Less competition and you could chat the girls up without it being to obvious or pressured

Man up.

You're on the verge of quitting after "several" dates. Guess what, there's over 3 billion women on earth, and most won't feel that spark. Keep looking until you find the one that does it for you and for her. You sound like you'll settle for the first one who doesn't reject you.

Which leads to my next point. You obsession with looks shows underconfidence and your assumption that women are shallow because they reject you is so pathetically self-serving that no message board advice is really going to sink in, anyway. Most people overrate their looks, so if you're on here saying you're average, odds are you're below. That doesn't mean you can't land a hottie. That means you have to get over your obsession yourself and your own appearance and attract women with something better than that.

The real issue is, women may find you physically attractive, but they realize after one date that there's NOTHING ELSE THERE. You see, eventually we all get old and physically ugly.

Do something interesting. Women are interested in interesting men. If women aren't interested in you, you are not interesting, no matter how "average" you look.

The spark thing is bullshit. It's just a woman's, excuse me, girl's excuse to blow a guy off after stealing a meal out of him.

They all say they want a nice guy, someone to treat them right, someone to split dates with/be in an equal partnership with, etc... Yet the moment one comes along, she writes him off because he's not "a bad boy".

Girls thrive on drama and want a guy that will cheat and hit and ignore her and anything else that is negative. Why? Because as children they're told if a boy hits you then he likes you. The seed is planted very early.

Girls want equality, yet refuse to ask guys on dates and then blame them when nothing happened between them. And then they expect to paid for on all dates because "he asked me". Well duh we're forced to. And they want to be showered with gifts constantly.

If men have to pay for everything, then girls shouldn't complain about being paid less in the workforce.

Girls are the biggest hypocrites because they don't even realize what they're doing or choose to ignore it.

Yes I am bitter about my dating life; but it's just ridiculous that girls are all gimmiegimmiegimmie and then complain about dating a douchecock that cheats on her every weekend and calls her a bitch to his friends.

I'm an above average looking guy (How do I know? women tell me) and I have a lot of trouble with dating too but for a different reason.

Like the OP I can usually pull a first date but I am actually the one who rarely feels a spark. The last two girls I've gone out with, I met online. One I had sex with but felt nothing for "spark" wise. The other, I went up to her place but decided she was too ugly to bang(and a bad kisser). On all dates I'm arrogant as hell. I also drive 90min for these dates (I live in a small town...hence the online dating) and I am presumptuous enough that I don't book a hotel...I tell them I just planned on sleeping at their place. They love this because women are crazy dumb when it comes to love and dating.

When I actually like a girl and try to respect her, I get nowhere. I have to force myself to play this game of disinterest and that I'm an arrogant douche - it's depressing.

The best advice was given earlier - join a club or some sort of social group. Meet women there and befriend them without the expectation of dating and then escalate. It will be easier on you and since there are no expectations, it will be easier to get to know the girl while you are both being yourself.

Online dating is terrible - very superficial. Girls that are 5' tall have profiles saying, "don't even contact me unless you are 6'3." I don't even want to talk to a girl who is that superficial.

CalvinJ is mostly right too...women rarely offer more than their looks and yet they expect you to be prince-charming. Try to find the girl who is down-to-earth and has something to offer besides beauty. For all the ones with nothing else to offer, be man enough, and have high enough standards, to REJECT THEM.

Getting to know them before is great as your personality does get chance to shine. However and it's a big however don't get caught in the friend zone. Happens very easily. Tips for that include don't talk to her about girly things,don't listen to her problems etc!

In my case i'm 5 foot 2 but way above average personality. That's the key you need an above average personality. I showed a picture to my parents of the girl im currently dating and they said....'that's not her that's a model' It was if they thought their 5 foot 2 son couldn't date a model. Trust me I can and that means so no excuse for you!

[quote]CalvinJ wrote:

The spark thing is bullshit. It's just a woman's, excuse me, girl's excuse to blow a guy off after stealing a meal out of him.

They all say they want a nice guy, someone to treat them right, someone to split dates with/be in an equal partnership with, etc... Yet the moment one comes along, she writes him off because he's not "a bad boy".

Girls thrive on drama and want a guy that will cheat and hit and ignore her and anything else that is negative. Why? Because as children they're told if a boy hits you then he likes you. The seed is planted very early.

Thanks for your opinion, but this is written awfully authoritatively and couldn't be more wrong for me and pretty much all of my friends.

I'm a girl, one who has had pretty much zero luck dating. (Hold off on the comments, I'm actually not a hideous freak). My point is, no girl is going on a date to "steal a meal". If they're on a date in the first place they want to find someone too. The "spark" comment is probably just an excuse for them realizing something wasn't right, or maybe circumstances changed in their life and they aren't available anymore.

Personally and for all of my friends, NONE of us want to be treated like crap or have a bad boy. I've never in my life been told if a boy hits you it means he likes you. I take someone being a jerk as a sign to peace out. I'm just looking for someone who I can talk to and relate to and find somewhat attractive, who, despite what you say, treats me well. I don't care so much about money, it can't make you happy anyways and I make enough of it.

Sorry to drone on, I guess I just get frustrated with all these super negative posts with such rash generalizations. This post obviously, but a ton of the running posts as well. It's a bummer how anonymity brings out the worst in people.