Heaviest sub-5:00 miler?

I've seen guys who must have been well over 250 pounds run marathons in the 3:00-3:05 range. Given that, I have no difficulty imagining someone larger running a mile in under 5 minutes.

The decathletes are probably the way to go for the heaviest under 5:00.

At the University of Washington, we had a center on the basketball team (Artem Wallace - 6'9", 250) run a 5:07 mile a few years ago.

Impressive, but Hingsen is the one who suspiciously "false started" ("Oh darn, I guess I'm out" followed by quick exit) his way out of the '88 Oly Decathlon when the whole Ben Johnson thing went down.

I don't think he would be the heaviest--as that would probably go to the ludicrous dude who devotes his life to running sub-5:00 while being maximally bulky and muscled--but Wilt Chamberlain, if he couldn't at some point in his life (R.I.P.), would easily be able to run sub-5:00 with a moderate amount of training. He was 7 feet tall, so definitely weighing in past 200 pounds. In a relatively lean but still sizable package, the man had so much athleticism--speed, strength, stamina, ability and versatility. I recall from his memoirs he did track events in high school and perhaps college and had some achievements he thought worth mentioning in the shotput, high jump and 400m. Towards the twilight of his NBA career or post-career, he also played competitive beach volleyball. He may have some weight lifting, too and other things, I forget.

I say that because I was reading another poster's post about rowers and the top-most range of super tall dudes. What would be the optimum height and background for getting the most body weight for your buck (while maintaining sub-5:00 capacity)?

The speculations in this thread and threads like it are very interesting.

I got a little lazy running from ages 22-25 but still managed a 4:58 at 6-1 205. Lost about 30lbs and back to running 4:30s now.

milethon wrote:

I got a little lazy running from ages 22-25 but still managed a 4:58 at 6-1 205. Lost about 30lbs and back to running 4:30s now.

200-220 shouldn't be all that unusual (but still inspiring), since there are probably many athletes, heights ~6'3" to ~6'11," that have the background and body to do it. The real interesting question is what the limit is, and what a hypothetical curve might look like. Approaching 240 and beyond--regardless of the height (6'4" or 7'2") and things begin to seem ridiculous, like those contests that grade school children do trying to guess how many M&Ms are in some huge jar....

Wilt Chamberlain was under 2:00 for the 880, and I have no doubt he would have been under 5:00. 275 pounds.

I think the real question is can anyone over 3 bucks do it?

Carnivore 69 wrote:

Wilt Chamberlain was under 2:00 for the 880, and I have no doubt he would have been under 5:00. 275 pounds.

I made the Wilt post before I saw the post about Kevin Willis (itself based on some info from a Sports Illustrated piece which may be have nonrigorous data), but now that I think about it, Wilt is probably the best candidate for "the job." The job is not necessarily the status of the athlete at a certain point in time but their potential. Obviously, athletes towards the very tall end of the prospect pool can push the limits of weight--distributed amongst their larger body--with less detriment to overall athleticism, control and running ability. But that seems to be less of a certainty and more of a theory the taller you go.

After reading your response about Wilt's 880 time and this number ("275") which is high, I think Wilt Chamberlain is probably the tallest guy who could run pretty fast and stand to weigh a lot and even gain more weight. I'm not really confident/informed about the range of his weight over his career and life. But this is just hypothetical, counterfactual, of course.

Let's set aside the man's personal preferences during his lifetime--long NBA career; intellectual, cultural, social and entertainment interests and engagements; and other sports. Say Wilt found the motivation to achieve the heaviest sub-5:00 miler in history status, and was willing to set aside participation in said peripheral activities that might be excessive (e.g. toning it down a bit to focus on specificity). With his weight lifting interest and social connections and resources, his natural strength and athleticism and ability to move his huge frame extremely competently, powerfully and quickly--maybe even give him modern technologies and amenities, Al Sal style--I think Wilt could have stood to put on even more muscle bulk that might not be entirely detrimental and even somewhat useful to his running and general fitness. I think he's the man for the job!

Ah, so indeed, Google and internet searches are confirming that number. While Wilt sometimes appeared slender--posing later for magazines post-career, or coming up in high school and college--those looks were very deceiving and video and anecdotes proved the guy was an absolute beast. For weight, he tops Kevin Willis. And this is just about doing sub 5:00, right? No extra points for doing low 4:00, hahaha. This is not the decathlon here, we are not doing a ranking produced from tabbing scoring in the two areas. I think hands down Wilt wins.

I also am of the opinion he beats out Shaq by a margin. When Shaq first came to the NBA, all young and spritely, he was quite explosive and agile--like a big a-- kid--if anyone grew up in the 90s and saw clips, him diving for loose balls and doing all sorts of antics. Obviously, he weighed less coming into the NBA than later in his career, and Yahoo! Answers says around 300lbs. I might also consult some sports almanacs/biographies or autobiographies to gain more insight, but I think Shaq in his optimal youth days would still have had to lose weight and done some mile training to get sub 5:00. I can't say how much (of training and weight loss), however. I think Shaq could at some point in those early/mid 90s days, have dipped under 5:00 (with training) yet still maintained a preposterous weight. But I think that Wilt had such athletic ability and more of a miler ceiling than Shaq that he could stand to gain more weight--and maybe more than Shaq--and still dip under 5:00... Very interesting.

I tried Googling "Shaq" and "mile time" and inadvertently found another similar Letsrun thread:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2796945

I can imagine there are probably more Letsrun threads on this topic.

All along, of course, I was thinking also about the NBA's well-known freakishly tall centers that people growing up in the 80s, 90s, and 00s might be familiar with.

I thought of people like Shawn Bradley and Manute bol but dismissed them, and not for the now-obvious reason that they were so skinny that they are trumped by possibly many big men of the NBA (if they could get down to 5:00m mile shape weight, assuming at least some could succeed if we throw eggs at the wall). I dismissed them because I thought being too freakishly tall might not be good for coordination and running fast (lol). But, maybe Yao Ming could do it? I noticed, too, unlike some of those other amusingly tall players, Yao has a lot of weight and upon further scrutiny, looks like he has enough self-control and decent health that he can carry it around well and even train for a sub-5:00 mile without losing too much weight...

Hmmm...

I thought it was generally accepted that when someone asks if something is possible, they are referring to everyone besides Wilt Chamberlain. Cause if it's possible then yeah Wilt could have done it.

Trey Hardee. 6’5 212 consistently ran 1500 at 4:40.

Heaviest sub 3:50 Abde Bile 175 3:49.44 Oslo 7/2/88
Heaviest sub 4:00 Jack Fath 190 3:59.5 June '68 Villanova Relays
-Close: Don MacMillan (AUS) 6'4' 200 4:05.8 2/19/95
Geoff Capes age 17 6'5 3/4" 245 4:48 Later, became 70'+ shot putter
Heaviest to break 5:00 Mike Ward 6'3" 295 4:59.9

Matt London

Niklaus Kaul (198lbs) runs 4:15 solo (with great form)at the end of a Deca, and he is only 21. Probably worth 4:20's mile fresh in the mile.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2eqFfwVFb4

Search ‘Alex Viada’ on these boards and you’ll get some great related threads.