SC Slim wrote:
I have attempted to educate. Nothing more. I can clearly see that its not working.
I have also never said you were wrong. I simply pointed out your argumentative fallacies. The logic upon which you base your conclusions is the only thing I have seen which is "shallow, sophomoric, and especially transparent."
I don't have all the facts. I never claimed to have all the facts.
No one does. Trying to use this to support your position is known as argument from ignorance. Please look it up.
Ignorance is defined as the lack of knowledge. I have no problem with someone being ignorant. Only when ignorance is used to support some pseudo-scientific claim that the universe was "begat" do issues arise.
Please don't take it personally, but you, my friend, are ignorant. At the least, you are ignorant of the basics rules of debate. I also suspect that you are also ignorant of the current theories relating to the beginning of the universe.
Ignorance is a situation easily overcome by education. Instead of proudly and repeatedly trumpeting your mental detriment to the world, you should attempt to better yourself with knowledge.
You have, in no way, given an adequate response. Where exactly have you attempted to educate? By challenging the notion that the beginning of time is beyond the constructs of the ability of the human mind to reason? So you may disagree, but are you really EDUCATING me? I think not. I'm not using logic or the lack of logic to corroborate my solutions, as you suggest. In fact, what I am saying is that logic, itself, has limitations, and to fall back on it wholeheartedly and perpetually is arrogant and short-sighted. Your use of the word "pseudo-scientific" actually does clearly establish your position that the scientific method is the ABSOLUTE barometer of truth, but I already knew your position from not being able to resist the urge to offer an unsolicited attack to begin with.
Choose another word besides begat, if you'd like. I am not saying that some notion of a man in the sky "begat" the universe. I am saying that I have no idea, and nor do you, and to assume that the scientific method can ultimately reveal "the answer" when we are bound by the limitations of the human mind is itself pseudo-scientific, because you cannot possibly ascertain what transcends the human mind, because, by definition, you are stuck in your mind. I am well aware of the current concepts about the beginning of the universe. I am also well aware of their flaws, limitations, and the prompting of another, practically infinite set of questions.
I am a student of genetic engineering (it was my major as well as the focus of my graduate work) and a Christian. I believe evolution and creationism are not incompatible, and I am open minded to both views, which you, clearly, are not. My original point was that to try to logically dissect the beginning of time is to limit yourself to the framework of the human mind and the scientific method, which, itself, has constraints. It's inconsequential to attempt to comprehend the beginning of energy, matter, time (or the non-beginning for that matter), because "the creation" does not ultimately lend itself to the rationality of the human mind. Now, you claim that such a position is ignorance, and yet, you have no way to prove that it is ignorance. So how is it that you can classify it as such?
Thanks for the education though, oh wise one.