Is an 18mile run at like 90s slower than 5k pace really that remarkable? Seems like a standard easy run…
I mean his HR avg would indicate it was easy. If it was run at park city - close to 7000 ft its closer to 70s slower which is a good indication of his aerobic strength with that HR. Who knows how that translates to a 5k or 10k.
What you need is his past history of runs like this. Was he doing 18 miles at 138 on 5:20 last year (not super encouraging) or 5:50( that’s encouraging). But some extent it is so know specific unless he is running some 50k, reading anything into it is waste of time. He ran sub 27 a month back. Dude is in shape but if that is 26:30 or 26:50 is beyond the level of accuracy we can expect.
And even predicting his marathon is tough. Going out and running at 4:50 pace is just so much harder. I can totally see not moving up when you top 6 in your event but all want to see if he can drop like a 58/2:04 and totally redo the US record list
I'm happy Grant posted his long run on the site for discussion. We didn't talk about why he posted it but I'm guessing he just posted it as a matter of course unless someone simply said 'post your long run.' To answer all the questions on the run, it was simple; a cruisy long run during the phase where he's gearing up for US Trials. It wasn't hard, it wasn't even 'purposeful.' It was just a nice longer run (slightly uphill for half, slightly downhill for half). Nothing more than that.
I'm happy Grant posted his long run on the site for discussion. We didn't talk about why he posted it but I'm guessing he just posted it as a matter of course unless someone simply said 'post your long run.' To answer all the questions on the run, it was simple; a cruisy long run during the phase where he's gearing up for US Trials. It wasn't hard, it wasn't even 'purposeful.' It was just a nice longer run (slightly uphill for half, slightly downhill for half). Nothing more than that.
Since you’re here, would you be willing to share his max HR? That would help inform the discussion of just how impressive this is.
FWIW, I looked at publicly posted data for a couple of his nearest competitors, and Grant’s HR seems way lower at this type of pace at this volume and altitude.
I'm happy Grant posted his long run on the site for discussion. We didn't talk about why he posted it but I'm guessing he just posted it as a matter of course unless someone simply said 'post your long run.' To answer all the questions on the run, it was simple; a cruisy long run during the phase where he's gearing up for US Trials. It wasn't hard, it wasn't even 'purposeful.' It was just a nice longer run (slightly uphill for half, slightly downhill for half). Nothing more than that.
We use lactate to determine effort level; even on long runs. So, this was 1.1-1.2 mmL. That is a typical long run effort. Honestly, it's very cruisy. The HR is collected here using a Garmin watch so it's just data that comes out of the Garmin. And unfortunately, I don't know his current max HR or I'd share it. We just don't use that to gauge effort (although it's a great tool).
We use lactate to determine effort level; even on long runs. So, this was 1.1-1.2 mmL. That is a typical long run effort. Honestly, it's very cruisy. The HR is collected here using a Garmin watch so it's just data that comes out of the Garmin. And unfortunately, I don't know his current max HR or I'd share it. We just don't use that to gauge effort (although it's a great tool).
How fast do you think Grant could do this after consuming 14 ice cold beers?
We use lactate to determine effort level; even on long runs. So, this was 1.1-1.2 mmL. That is a typical long run effort. Honestly, it's very cruisy. The HR is collected here using a Garmin watch so it's just data that comes out of the Garmin. And unfortunately, I don't know his current max HR or I'd share it. We just don't use that to gauge effort (although it's a great tool).
How fast do you think Grant could do this after consuming 14 ice cold beers?
Sorry Budweiser CEO, Grant ain’t consuming any Bud Light after your advertising blunder.
I'm happy Grant posted his long run on the site for discussion. We didn't talk about why he posted it but I'm guessing he just posted it as a matter of course unless someone simply said 'post your long run.' To answer all the questions on the run, it was simple; a cruisy long run during the phase where he's gearing up for US Trials. It wasn't hard, it wasn't even 'purposeful.' It was just a nice longer run (slightly uphill for half, slightly downhill for half). Nothing more than that.
Since you’re here, would you be willing to share his max HR? That would help inform the discussion of just how impressive this is.
FWIW, I looked at publicly posted data for a couple of his nearest competitors, and Grant’s HR seems way lower at this type of pace at this volume and altitude.
Max HR is important in context. Some Elites have low max rate. It's not automatically 200 to 220.
Does anyone remember Rupp running 4:50s and his hr not getting over 150? Or his lr of 5:28 average with a 4:28 at the end, I’d say both more impressive than fishers.
We use lactate to determine effort level; even on long runs. So, this was 1.1-1.2 mmL. That is a typical long run effort. Honestly, it's very cruisy. The HR is collected here using a Garmin watch so it's just data that comes out of the Garmin. And unfortunately, I don't know his current max HR or I'd share it. We just don't use that to gauge effort (although it's a great tool).
Thanks for the very helpful info! HR chest strap or no?
Good but not great. Adam Goucher in Running with the Buffaloes ran I believe 22 miles at similar pace hilly I believe but not as high altitude as Park City
We use lactate to determine effort level; even on long runs. So, this was 1.1-1.2 mmL. That is a typical long run effort. Honestly, it's very cruisy. The HR is collected here using a Garmin watch so it's just data that comes out of the Garmin. And unfortunately, I don't know his current max HR or I'd share it. We just don't use that to gauge effort (although it's a great tool).
Hello Coach Scannell. We're all much obliged to you for offering your insights above.
Grant mentioned in his post-LA Grand Prix-race interview that he was just now starting his "big swing up" into the championship phase of the season.
Two questions come to mind:
1) Grant admitted to what many have seen since his 2022 WC 10k race in Eugene: his final lap needs more work, especially his decision making where he allows a gap to form with the leaders down the backstretch. How does addressing this (seemingly only) flaw in his racing translate to adjustments in training? Is this something that can be corrected through heart rate monitoring & lactate testing? Or, is the approach primarily mental?
2) Might there be a final "tune-up" race between now and the Trials; I.e., possibly a 1500 @ Portland Track Festival or another venue?
First of all yes thats an amazing workout from one of the best American athletes. But, provided the 138 HR avg is accurate in the first place, it's more likely he has a lower HR max (I'm guessing like 180 or low 180s) which would make this more like 76%. It does remind me of Rupp's workouts where his HR never got too high and iirc it's the same case with Galen, who also has a mHR around 180
Still an incredible workout though!!! Why doesnt Grant race the half more? Never understood this
HR data is meaningless without knowing a person's HR max, their HR theshold, and what they would typically average for an easy run (and that's an actual EASY run - not an "I'm just going by feel" easy run, where you're actually running at pretty much LT1).
Let's say his threshold is at 155, then his long run doesn't seem all that impressive (for an elite). However, if his threshold is at 175, then it is.