...Flatt was older in HS last year at this point than Sumner is right now, btw
Not true lol
Lots of lapdogs for Sumner - because supporting him shows one is woke. Hah
I like making everything a political battle too honestly it just makes things miserable and I love being miserable.
Craig fans? Republicans.
Liberals seem to like Teare and Hocker more.
Sumner vs Flatt is definitely a good politically polarizing 800m rivalry. Flatt is very alphamale mentality and he goes to ole miss (conservative) and Sumner is seemingly Hispanic (liberal)
Brazier still did far better. Why are almost all American runners so slow?
For reference, Kenya has 8 sub 1:46 athletes including 6 at altitude, 7 sub 3:35 athletes including 2 at Nairobi, and 9 sub 13:10. You're almost certain to see at least one Kenyan medal in every distance event at the Olympics/Worlds.
America's "best" runners only receive very infrequent silver and bronze medals.
Kenya has an over training issue the last four to eight weeks prior to Olympics and W.C. Kenyan men are not machines. It is possible for individuals born and raised about 5000ft. elevation to train too hard at elevation. Altitude training can be too much of a good thing for all. See 2012 Summer Olympics men 1500m final. I believe there were about 6 or 7 men in 1500m final who were born in Kenya. Not one of them earned a medal. See 2016 Summer Olympics men 1500m final. Not one Kenyan earned a medal. We'll see.
Lots of lapdogs for Sumner - because supporting him shows one is woke. Hah
I like making everything a political battle too honestly it just makes things miserable and I love being miserable.
Craig fans? Republicans.
Liberals seem to like Teare and Hocker more.
Sumner vs Flatt is definitely a good politically polarizing 800m rivalry. Flatt is very alphamale mentality and he goes to ole miss (conservative) and Sumner is seemingly Hispanic (liberal)
As a conservative, who are you rooting for on the 1500m final?
Not true. They confer an advantage of 2 seconds, at least, in the 1500. They probably don’t do anything in the 800, true, maybe a little. The primary thing with these shoes is they allow athletes do harder workouts and to recover more quickly. But they definitely help in races from 1500 on up.
I think Sumner will run 1:45-something but not sub-1:45 since he has other races to run. We’ll see. Kid is capable of a sub-1:45 right now, but I’m going to say 1:45.33 for grins.
It’s a lot more complicated than just an even conversion rate.
Dragonflies were designed for people running 4:00 mile pace, as they are intended to be the 5000m spike for elites, Nike actually used to push the victory more for the mile and 3k and said the dragonflies were 5k-10k. They are made to work best when someone is running at that pace with good mechanics.
My theory is that the spikes help people racing right at about 4:00 mile pace the most, that’s why we aren’t seeing the 1500m/mile records drop or even be threatened, but the amount of 3:57-4:05 milers in the world has gone up by a massive amount.
In my personal experience, I’ve felt no benefit from dragonfly’s or air victory’s in racing, but they are much nicer on my tendons and calves than normal spikes and my legs thank me the next day.
You seem pretty logical. But seriously?
You think the spikes help a very small group of sub elite runners right around a 4 min mile?
Wouldn’t a more plausible explanation be that other age groups (elementary to college) are training harder and smarter so therefore running faster times, younger?
IMO, the spikes either work or they don’t. Because the evidence has not been there at the elite level we have to use mental gymnastics to try to create theories of beneficial use cases.
This thread went a bit off the rails from it's title... back to Sumner.
Obviously, he is a massive talent, but it is good to see that his training at Georgia has not hurt his 800. There were concerns, by some posters on this board, with him lifting more and doing so much speedwork that his 800 would suffer. It's nice to see him succeed even without attending a school known for its mid distance prowess.
This thread went a bit off the rails from it's title... back to Sumner.
Obviously, he is a massive talent, but it is good to see that his training at Georgia has not hurt his 800. There were concerns, by some posters on this board, with him lifting more and doing so much speedwork that his 800 would suffer. It's nice to see him succeed even without attending a school known for its mid distance prowess.
He was super low mileage in high school (I believe he said like 10-15mpw?) and apparently has been running more volume (but still pretty low) so he probably has only improved aerobically
I like making everything a political battle too honestly it just makes things miserable and I love being miserable.
Craig fans? Republicans.
Liberals seem to like Teare and Hocker more.
Sumner vs Flatt is definitely a good politically polarizing 800m rivalry. Flatt is very alphamale mentality and he goes to ole miss (conservative) and Sumner is seemingly Hispanic (liberal)
Flatt may be alpha male mentally but he is not an alpha male. He’s sort of a “wanna be alpha.”
Sumner is biracial. His dad is white & his mom is black.
Everything doesn’t need to have a political bent to it. And tbh, most college kids the age of Summer & Flatt don’t give politics a second thought.
Also, stratifying someone into a political party or ideology just because of their ethnic background makes a lot of assumptions. Identity politics is tiring. I’m Jewish but consider myself to be politically moderate even though most Jews tend to be liberal. I know Jews on both ends of the political spectrum. The same is true for Hispanic people, Black people, or just about any other peoples of whatever ethnic background.
It’s never good to make assumptions about people before you know them and quite frankly, it is ignorant to do so.
Running the 2nd (and also the 3rd, 4th, 6th, and 7th) fastest HS 800 of all time and making it to the semifinals of the world team trials didn't prove himself? As far as I'm concerned he's the most accomplished 800 runner of all time, I think his "cockiness" was earned.
I like making everything a political battle too honestly it just makes things miserable and I love being miserable.
Craig fans? Republicans.
Liberals seem to like Teare and Hocker more.
Sumner vs Flatt is definitely a good politically polarizing 800m rivalry. Flatt is very alphamale mentality and he goes to ole miss (conservative) and Sumner is seemingly Hispanic (liberal)
Flatt may be alpha male mentally but he is not an alpha male. He’s sort of a “wanna be alpha.”
Sumner is biracial. His dad is white & his mom is black.
Everything doesn’t need to have a political bent to it. And tbh, most college kids the age of Summer & Flatt don’t give politics a second thought.
Also, stratifying someone into a political party or ideology just because of their ethnic background makes a lot of assumptions. Identity politics is tiring. I’m Jewish but consider myself to be politically moderate even though most Jews tend to be liberal. I know Jews on both ends of the political spectrum. The same is true for Hispanic people, Black people, or just about any other peoples of whatever ethnic background.
It’s never good to make assumptions about people before you know them and quite frankly, it is ignorant to do so.
Good post. Accurate. The young-uns on here would do well to actually read this and understand it. Identity politics is tiring, all identity politics, not just race.
This thread went a bit off the rails from it's title... back to Sumner.
Obviously, he is a massive talent, but it is good to see that his training at Georgia has not hurt his 800. There were concerns, by some posters on this board, with him lifting more and doing so much speedwork that his 800 would suffer. It's nice to see him succeed even without attending a school known for its mid distance prowess.
Indeed, it seems like the guy is destined for greatness if he’s smart.
It’s a lot more complicated than just an even conversion rate.
Dragonflies were designed for people running 4:00 mile pace, as they are intended to be the 5000m spike for elites, Nike actually used to push the victory more for the mile and 3k and said the dragonflies were 5k-10k. They are made to work best when someone is running at that pace with good mechanics.
My theory is that the spikes help people racing right at about 4:00 mile pace the most, that’s why we aren’t seeing the 1500m/mile records drop or even be threatened, but the amount of 3:57-4:05 milers in the world has gone up by a massive amount.
In my personal experience, I’ve felt no benefit from dragonfly’s or air victory’s in racing, but they are much nicer on my tendons and calves than normal spikes and my legs thank me the next day.
You seem pretty logical. But seriously?
You think the spikes help a very small group of sub elite runners right around a 4 min mile?
Nope, I think they help a large group of runners at any age. I know they helped my daughter PR by four seconds just by virtue of getting new shoes. This is part of the reason why (not the entire reason), as many on the recruiting threads on here have noted, that coaches no longer view a sub-5:00 girl the way they once did. Sub-4:50 is the new standard.
I already said the new shoes allow athletes to train harder and absorb more pounding with quicker recovery. So, yeah, this has enabled athletes across the spectrum to improve substantially. 8:50 is the new 9:00 for the boys’ 3200.
Not true. They confer an advantage of 2 seconds, at least, in the 1500. They probably don’t do anything in the 800, true, maybe a little. The primary thing with these shoes is they allow athletes do harder workouts and to recover more quickly. But they definitely help in races from 1500 on up.
I think Sumner will run 1:45-something but not sub-1:45 since he has other races to run. We’ll see. Kid is capable of a sub-1:45 right now, but I’m going to say 1:45.33 for grins.
It’s a lot more complicated than just an even conversion rate.
Dragonflies were designed for people running 4:00 mile pace, as they are intended to be the 5000m spike for elites, Nike actually used to push the victory more for the mile and 3k and said the dragonflies were 5k-10k. They are made to work best when someone is running at that pace with good mechanics.
My theory is that the spikes help people racing right at about 4:00 mile pace the most, that’s why we aren’t seeing the 1500m/mile records drop or even be threatened, but the amount of 3:57-4:05 milers in the world has gone up by a massive amount.
In my personal experience, I’ve felt no benefit from dragonfly’s or air victory’s in racing, but they are much nicer on my tendons and calves than normal spikes and my legs thank me the next day.
How can you design a shoe to work best when running at a certain pace? I'm no engineer, but I'm really having to stretch my imagination to figure out how that could be possible.