You don't think that the whole world has been discussing this for years? She's a California athlete and it's relevant. Why wouldn't she ask me about it?
Trans athletes have no place in women’s sports. Not an easy solution, but it is the fairest solution.
Having a non-binary/trans category with some nominal prize money is fine too as long as it doesn’t take away from the other competitors. No one deserves to win $1000 for running 2:40 and being slower than females.
But the position of most people isn't that "trans athletes have no place in women's sports." It's that male athletes of any kind don't belong in women's and girls' sports.
Women's and girls' sport were created for female people. Female is a sex category that automatically excludes all males, regardless of how some male might see themselves, what kind of gender identity (if any) they have or claim to have, what kind of personalities and interests and inclinations they have, and how they express themselves in terms of "gender presentation" - meaning how they dress, wear their hair, groom, adorn themselves, talk, sound, move, gesture, engage in sexual relations, etc.
Female athletes who "identify as" trans definitely have a place in women's and girls' sports. So long as female athletes with trans identities are not taking exogenous T or other anabolic steroids, and they haven't taken those drugs in the past, there is no issue about them participating and competing in girls' and women's sports.
In the 2021-22 swim season, two "trans athletes" attending Ivy League schools competed in women's college swimming in the US, and both of them raced in the Division I women's category at the 2022 NCAA national championships. But the only trans swimmer whose place in women's competition - and the women's locker room - was contested, protetested and complained about in 2021-22 was the male trans athlete, Lia Thomas of Penn. No one objected to the female trans athlete Iszac Henig of Yale competing in women's races, or using the women's locker room, either. Because although Henig had already undergone a double mastectomy before the 2021-22 college swimming season began , Henig is a female who decided to put off taking exogenous testosterone until that season was over.
Far from ideal, but have daughter talk to other competitors. Take a step at the start, and then sit on the track for the rest of the "race". Takes a whole lot of guts to do that as a young girl, but could truly be a world-changing decision if they go through with it.
Did you ask your Collegiate daughter if she cared or not? You say that she did not “seem” to care. I would be interested.
From the video of the South Section race, it seems that patents were not on board with this. Comments were “trip her”…. Seemed to come from moms more than dads. They were saying that out loud. So they did not seem embarrassed about such thoughts.
However, I did not hear any kids say bad things. Kids seemed ok with it.
Since it’s a HS meet, maybe the kids should decide and the parents can keep their opinions to themselves.
I actually am curious about this and I agree. The hs kids should be the ones to determine what to do here. If they aren’t bothered adults should stand down.
but if they are bothered and afraid to speak up it is on adults to be their voices.
Have you ever met a teenager? They are not afraid to let their opinions be known. They don’t need their parents to be their mouthpiece. Actually that is one of the most embarrassing thing that a teenager can experience
You don't think that the whole world has been discussing this for years? She's a California athlete and it's relevant. Why wouldn't she ask me about it?
Guess I should go buy a lottery ticket!
You’re making the argument that people never lie. You aren’t even a registered user so we have no way of judging your credibility. You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
As stated before, state federations need to implement new rules and/or create a category for transgendered athletes. That will take time. Time is not a luxury that current high school and college athletes have. You have to play the cards that you are dealt. Winners with character will find a way.
No, it does not take time. Before the next weekend, CIF can announce the following.
1. A trans athlete will not replace anyone in the final. If one or both of them make the final, the next fastest runner(s) will be added to the final.
2. A trans athlete will not replace anyone in the award. Either make them ineligible for the award, or give then duplicate award without demoting anyone below them.
Then they will have to decide on the new rule before the next season. If they are serious about this, one summer should be good enough to come up with a solution. If they cannot, they can continue the above measure #1 and #2 at all levels, including the conference and the district.
Not so fast.
Even if CIF could make a rule change on the fly, their legal people would need to review it and analyze the potential exposure. IMHO, the fallout from the current scenario will be short lived and forgotten within a few weeks. Dealing with bad public relations and some articles on conservative media is fiscally inexpensive. The state legislature isn’t going to do anything and I don’t think that any lawsuits from cis girls would stick as it would be very difficult to prove financial damages.
Boot the transgender competitors? Then buckle up for an avalanche of both state and federal discrimination lawsuits from the aggrieved parties and rights groups. Also watch the legislature in Sacramento investigate and audit CIF into the ground.
Nope. CIF and their counsel will convene over the summer to write new rules for transgender athletes that will take effect in time for the 2023/2024 school year. Bureaucracies are always risk averse and only act swiftly when it is a universal issue like safety.
When the girls are called to the starting line they should all stand one step back and see what the starter does. I hope they protest but I wouldn't want to see them miss the race. Maybe give the crowd the thumbs down 👎
You don't think that the whole world has been discussing this for years? She's a California athlete and it's relevant. Why wouldn't she ask me about it?
Guess I should go buy a lottery ticket!
You’re making the argument that people never lie. You aren’t even a registered user so we have no way of judging your credibility. You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
Obviously SDSU didn't teach you how probability works. There are 24 athletes in the OP's daughter's situation. The chances that at least one parent of the 24 reads Letsrun is very high. What you are doing is just trying to dox and harass him/her. And please don't waste your money on lottery tickets
No, it does not take time. Before the next weekend, CIF can announce the following.
1. A trans athlete will not replace anyone in the final. If one or both of them make the final, the next fastest runner(s) will be added to the final.
2. A trans athlete will not replace anyone in the award. Either make them ineligible for the award, or give then duplicate award without demoting anyone below them.
Then they will have to decide on the new rule before the next season. If they are serious about this, one summer should be good enough to come up with a solution. If they cannot, they can continue the above measure #1 and #2 at all levels, including the conference and the district.
Not so fast.
Even if CIF could make a rule change on the fly, their legal people would need to review it and analyze the potential exposure. IMHO, the fallout from the current scenario will be short lived and forgotten within a few weeks. Dealing with bad public relations and some articles on conservative media is fiscally inexpensive. The state legislature isn’t going to do anything and I don’t think that any lawsuits from cis girls would stick as it would be very difficult to prove financial damages.
Boot the transgender competitors? Then buckle up for an avalanche of both state and federal discrimination lawsuits from the aggrieved parties and rights groups. Also watch the legislature in Sacramento investigate and audit CIF into the ground.
Nope. CIF and their counsel will convene over the summer to write new rules for transgender athletes that will take effect in time for the 2023/2024 school year. Bureaucracies are always risk averse and only act swiftly when it is a universal issue like safety.
But who is going to legally challenge the temporary measure?
Trans athletes will be allowed to compete, and receive a duplicate medal if they place in the final.
Cis athletes will not lose a spot in the final, and will not lose an award to a trans athlete.
You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
You're confusing unlikely with impossible ... which coming from you is not surprising.
Also, the OP is claiming to be the parent of a girl who is running the 1600 at the California state meet. Your denominator of 332 million is ridiculous. You're already off by an order of magnitude because it's the California state meet not the USA meet. And I'd wager that the likelihood of there being a parent of California high school girl who runs track posting on LRC is actually rather high.
You’re making the argument that people never lie. You aren’t even a registered user so we have no way of judging your credibility. You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
Obviously SDSU didn't teach you how probability works. There are 24 athletes in the OP's daughter's situation. The chances that at least one parent of the 24 reads Letsrun is very high. What you are doing is just trying to dox and harass him/her. And please don't waste your money on lottery tickets
…and let’s also remember that the odds that one of the two trans kids (and their parents) are reading this board is also high
In the race video, I was shocked at what the parents were saying in the stands. The athlete’s parent were surely in the stands not too far away and the kid herself surely watched the race video afterwards.
You’re making the argument that people never lie. You aren’t even a registered user so we have no way of judging your credibility. You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
This situation needs to be approached in away that shows the unfairness to girls but also recognizes that trans people are going through something and want to compete.
I stick with my solution of having an open category and a female category.
Identifying as female to be viewed that way isn’t enough to be allowed to compete against them with an unfair advantage. They shouldn’t be banned from athletics completely.
You claim to be one of the fathers of a group of 25 athletes in a country of 332M, so, yeah, you should buy a lottery ticket.
You're confusing unlikely with impossible ... which coming from you is not surprising.
Also, the OP is claiming to be the parent of a girl who is running the 1600 at the California state meet. Your denominator of 332 million is ridiculous. You're already off by an order of magnitude because it's the California state meet not the USA meet. And I'd wager that the likelihood of there being a parent of California high school girl who runs track posting on LRC is actually rather high.
Please stop this. You're embarrassing yourself.
People never lie on LR? You don’t believe the story is too convenient? He posted that he told his daughter that there was virtually no chance she would ever run against transgender athletes, which is true, but now that it happened, it’s a big problem that’s not going away. What about the millions of parents that don’t have a child competing against transgender athletes?
Serious-but-mostly-rhetorical question for all of you screeching about how "YoU vOTeD fOR tHiS!!" - who exactly am I supposed to vote for if I...
- generally find the woke stuff to be stupid at best and harmful at worst
- support female's rights and worker's rights
- have utter disdain for the U.S.'s foreign policy
- generally find the GOP to be repugnant and the Dems to be either incompetent, corrupt, stupid, or some combination of these.
The answer is a big fat nobody (in a two-party system at least), but then your friends and family all yell at you for wasting your vote or helping the bad guy win, etc.
To bring my post more on topic, opposing the biological males racing against females shouldn't automatically get you labeled as a bigot and canceled, dismissed as a M4G4 dipsh*t, or what have you. But holding this position without also getting on board with the psychotic agenda of the GOP makes you politically homeless.
My feelings? I am a WOMAN with DAUGHTERS. I bet you are a MAN force feeding your feelings to ME!
This is the most mansplaining of mansplaining ever. I bet if an unqualified woman took your job you would be up in arms. Take a seat my dude. You don’t speak for WOMEN!
don't you understand, honey, men know best for everyone, and men make the best women too-- now that they're given a chance...
seriously, you are 1000% correct but wait for it-- here comes a "feminist" man to call you names and say "sis" girls and women just don't get it.
What needs to happen is the girls simply walk off the track refusing to compete.
The solution is for a couple of girls to walk off the track and not compete? Talking about really losing an opportunity, that's losing more then losing to one of the mentioned athletes. You won't get everyone that's for sure. Not everyone thinks the same way you do.