The criminal standard of proof isn't used because the accused is not facing a possible criminal penalty. Furthermore, with the bar set that high, of beyond reasonable doubt instead of what SafeSport finds believable, it would be incredibly difficult to reach a finding against the accused, and could take years to determine. That would deter young victims from seeking help and lessen the likelihood of holding coaches accountable who abuse their position. Safesport does not have the resources to conduct what would effectively be a police investigation.
Many commenters here do not understand that Salazar has been subject to complaint before a sports regulatory body, like a lawyer who is subject to complaint before a Bar Association. These are professional disciplinary bodies, not criminal courts. So he has been "struck off", so to speak, but not sent to gaol.
There is a lot of room between "believe all survivors" and "beyond reasable doubt"
if safesport doesn't have the resources beyond that, they shouldn't have the power they possess.
They have much the same power as any other professional regulatory body.
It's reassuring to see that Letsrun conforms to character, when a public complaint of sexual abuse by a female athlete against a coach who has been sanctioned for sexual abuse of a minor is routinely disbelieved or discredited by posters. I would be shocked if it wasn't so.
Salazar has been "sanctioned for sexual abuse of a minor"? That would be news to me. Are you referring to Mary Cain? She said he was emotionally abusing her and pushing her towards an eating disorder by focusing too much on weight. Are you being lazy again? Those were Kara's main complaints also [ until she upped the ante with the sexual assault allegations.]
So their main allegations [until Kara's massage accusations] were exactly similar to what some Colorado runners are accusing Wetmore of. And in that case Kara is standing up for the coach and the accused not the Accuser!
If you and others are so upset at some posters for not fully backing Kara, why are you not taking a similar stand against Kara for not fully backing the female accusers of Wetmore????
The problem with "report it to law enforcement" in a case like this is that all that would happen is that a report would get filled out. There is no way to prove digital penetration or anything else actually happened. I agree that there are problems with the power Safe Sport has but without it or something that does what it does it's hard to see what recourse there'd be for an athlete who is violated by a coach. Getting another coach is an obvious solution but does nothing to address the problem of a predatory coach and does not protect future unsuspecting athletes from that coach.
It’s hard to see what recourse there’d be for a coach whose career prematurely ended because of a post-hoc rewriting of memory or even entirely made-up charges out of spite, but it sounds like that possibility doesn’t concern you much.
I never understand people who decide they know what another person who's written something is thinking more than the author himself does. Did you not see the sentence that says I agree that there are problems with the power Safe Sport has or just decide to ignore it because it doesn't fit with what you've decided does or doesn't bother me? If it didn't bother me I wouldn't have said it's a problem. But I also see a problem if the only recourse athletes have with a predatory coach is going to the police.
I read his comment as implying pros and coaches should get equal protection of due process of law. If a person is to be banned from his lifelong profession for life — not just fired from a single company but unable to work at all in the running world that is his entire world — the bar for proof beyond reasonable doubt should be higher. A pro is not quite as helpless as a college athlete.
Do we have all the details of the SafeSport investigation or assuming they simply took her word for it and banned him? Besides, she was not the only one who reported his abuse.
Are you conflating “abuse” with sexual assault with your claim? Without Kara’s sexual assault allegation, there was nothing of substance. SafeSport dropped the emotional misconduct charge and Salazar publicly presented plenty of e-mail evidence to suggest that he was just deferring to his athletes’ doctors and nutritionists.
I never understand people who decide they know what another person who's written something is thinking more than the author himself does. Did you not see the sentence that says I agree that there are problems with the power Safe Sport has or just decide to ignore it because it doesn't fit with what you've decided does or doesn't bother me? If it didn't bother me I wouldn't have said it's a problem. But I also see a problem if the only recourse athletes have with a predatory coach is going to the police.
I said it “sounds like … that doesn’t concern you much” because you only presented one side of a dual concern. You are imagining the rest above about mind reading or malice.
If you agree that an innocent coach losing his career because of a spiteful or otherwise false allegation is just as heinous as nonconsensual digital penetration of an athlete, then we are on the same page.
It's reassuring to see that Letsrun conforms to character, when a public complaint of sexual abuse by a female athlete against a coach who has been sanctioned for sexual abuse of a minor is routinely disbelieved or discredited by posters. I would be shocked if it wasn't so.
Salazar has been "sanctioned for sexual abuse of a minor"? That would be news to me. Are you referring to Mary Cain? She said he was emotionally abusing her and pushing her towards an eating disorder by focusing too much on weight. Are you being lazy again? Those were Kara's main complaints also [ until she upped the ante with the sexual assault allegations.]
So their main allegations [until Kara's massage accusations] were exactly similar to what some Colorado runners are accusing Wetmore of. And in that case Kara is standing up for the coach and the accused not the Accuser!
If you and others are so upset at some posters for not fully backing Kara, why are you not taking a similar stand against Kara for not fully backing the female accusers of Wetmore????
Salazar has been sanctioned for sexual abuse as well as psychological abuse of other of his young athletes. Their accusations were accepted by SafeSport. He has also been banned for doping infractions. This is the guy you want to defend?
Claudio Reyna being a jack@ss and Alberto Salazar being abusive are "news" this week yet things anyone paying attention has known for YEARS. What an odd week.
Anyway, it is very telling that the diehard Kara hater(/haters) dwindled after the # of anonymous user handles per thread were limited a couple years ago and have decreased even more on threads requiring a registered anonymous handle.
I think saying there's a problem with the authority Safe Sport has does present both sides but whatever. Yes, we could be on the same page but maybe not. If you want to use a legal standard to decide if a coach is innocent or guilty we probably aren't. The standard for conviction is pretty high and would rarely apply to situations like this alleged one.
Salazar has been "sanctioned for sexual abuse of a minor"? That would be news to me. Are you referring to Mary Cain? She said he was emotionally abusing her and pushing her towards an eating disorder by focusing too much on weight. Are you being lazy again? Those were Kara's main complaints also [ until she upped the ante with the sexual assault allegations.]
So their main allegations [until Kara's massage accusations] were exactly similar to what some Colorado runners are accusing Wetmore of. And in that case Kara is standing up for the coach and the accused not the Accuser!
If you and others are so upset at some posters for not fully backing Kara, why are you not taking a similar stand against Kara for not fully backing the female accusers of Wetmore????
Salazar has been sanctioned for sexual abuse as well as psychological abuse of other of his young athletes. Their accusations were accepted by SafeSport. He has also been banned for doping infractions. This is the guy you want to defend?
I of course don't know for sure which accusations against Salazar are true or not. But by many accounts he appears to be a shady, possibly sleazy jerk at times. So I'm not defending him as a person. But details matter.
You said he was "sanctioned for sexual abuse of other young athletes". I do not think that is exactly accurate. Unless you count sexual abuse as him saying to a female "your butt is too big , lose some weight."
My understanding is the only true sexual abuse allegations came from Kara. Mary Cain alleged " emotional abuse" and *"physical abuse"* but it seems the latter was due to Al giving her diuretics and potentially other unhealthy supplements/drugs....?
Maybe I'm wrong if so show me. If not don't suddenly exaggerate the level and amounts of accusations against him.
Because as I said until the recent Kara massage allegations the allegations against Salazar were not that different than the ones currently against Wetmore [ okay yes they were also allegations of rubbing testosterone cream on his sons and IV use above a certain limits for that one supplement....?]. And Kara does not believe those allegations against Wetmore apparently
Salazar has been sanctioned for sexual abuse as well as psychological abuse of other of his young athletes. Their accusations were accepted by SafeSport. He has also been banned for doping infractions. This is the guy you want to defend?
I of course don't know for sure which accusations against Salazar are true or not. But by many accounts he appears to be a shady, possibly sleazy jerk at times. So I'm not defending him as a person. But details matter.
You said he was "sanctioned for sexual abuse of other young athletes". I do not think that is exactly accurate. Unless you count sexual abuse as him saying to a female "your butt is too big , lose some weight."
My understanding is the only true sexual abuse allegations came from Kara. Mary Cain alleged " emotional abuse" and *"physical abuse"* but it seems the latter was due to Al giving her diuretics and potentially other unhealthy supplements/drugs....?
Maybe I'm wrong if so show me. If not don't suddenly exaggerate the level and amounts of accusations against him.
Because as I said until the recent Kara massage allegations the allegations against Salazar were not that different than the ones currently against Wetmore [ okay yes they were also allegations of rubbing testosterone cream on his sons and IV use above a certain limits for that one supplement....?]. And Kara does not believe those allegations against Wetmore apparently
Her opinions on another case have no relevance to events that happened to her. Her accusations are based on what she says she experienced. If SafeSport had not accepted her allegations we would have grounds for questioning their veracity - but they did accept them.
Salazar has shown that he has breached accepted standards in the sport - that includes the doping infractions as well as the abuse accusations - on several occasions. His denials were not accepted in either instance. Kara's accusations were believed by the professional body that oversees issues of conduct by coaches. Taking all of this into account, we have no reason to disbelieve her.
Lmao, you’re just mad you can’t harass women with impunity anymore
But he’s not wrong in saying that she has something to gain from it. People are more likely to buy a sexual assault survivor’s book for one, and she gets a lot of publicity because media is obligated to report on it and place her on a pedestal for being brave. She has nothing to lose because anyone who gives a sexual assault survivor grief would be immediately canceled.
While I think personally 100% that Kara was unfortunately taken advantage of, I could see where more cynical people would question her motives and I get your publicity take, esp. in today's fame-driven world. That said, it sounds like her complaints are legit and Al Sal made big errors. Al Sal's mistakes tarnished his legacy.
Huh? I offer her my complete sympathy and I'm a misogynist? Are you suggesting I should have called "sexual assault" an "appropriate coach-athlete situation"?
I don't really know all the facts here, since these kinds of details are kept secret, so I offer my sympathy based on her feelings, regardless, within this coach-athlete power dynamic.
So typically mealy-mouthed. An "inappropriate (only "inappropriate"?) coach-athlete situation" saw him banned for life. How appropriate. Given your previous defences of his doping infractions I'm surprised you aren't also extending him your "sympathy". But if we include his doping ban he does appear to have quite a record of "inappropriate coach-athlete situations".
Am I expected to offer my sympathy for "appropriate" situations, or for situations that she was "comfortable" with? Not sure what the faux-pas here is exactly, or if you are being artificially contrarian out of principle.
I also offered my complete sympathy for other reported situations, like a drunken attempted kiss on a plane, and public weigh-ins in underwear, and comments on losing weight after childbirth, etc.
What is so controversial here about widening the set of situations that I am sympathetic with?
But he’s not wrong in saying that she has something to gain from it. People are more likely to buy a sexual assault survivor’s book for one, and she gets a lot of publicity because media is obligated to report on it and place her on a pedestal for being brave. She has nothing to lose because anyone who gives a sexual assault survivor grief would be immediately canceled.
While I think personally 100% that Kara was unfortunately taken advantage of, I could see where more cynical people would question her motives and I get your publicity take, esp. in today's fame-driven world. That said, it sounds like her complaints are legit and Al Sal made big errors. Al Sal's mistakes tarnished his legacy.
We all have our own opinions about the sexual assault complaint, and opinion is all one can have in the absence of provable facts.
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