Another run across America underway - is it legit? Boots currently on the ground

The oddest detail is that RB, in the very same article, confirms that they supposedly don't know what causes the weird data.

And yet the weird data, time and time again, ceased to be weird to anywhere near the same extent when WC demanded that they clean it up. It went from being entire afternoons - or even days - of running, to one or two miles here or there, or one stretch on day 26 when he ran with RB and WC was over there.

This implies that on every occasion the data was 'clean' on days they needed it to be clean, it was just complete luck. Complete coincidence: if they don't know what causes it then they presumably don't know how to produce the 'clean' data. And yet it happened. Multiple times.

Come on. The wrist-based HR monitors WG wore could be wrong 100% of the time, but it's the extremely specific way they're wrong that's the issue.

You don't need to know anything about running, HR data, the accuracy of HR data, or any other factor to recognise the problem with this.

School yard antics never really end, and this is one of them. Pile on the guy who unabashedly has an interest in something - especially if it's a niche interest. Write it off as eccentric, and ask "Why do you care, anyway?"

Ironically, it's journalists who embody this behaviour more than anyone. There are plenty of good ones about, but all too often they're snide individuals with no skin the game.

Few of them even care to do their damn jobs and actually publish daring stories - "this is all "on background" for me. To put it bluntly, I don't see Outside taking an interest...". Of course you don't - and they wouldn't - this is why journalism is a dying industry. I've seen more spine in jellyfish.

Precisely.

Are we supposed to believe that on those days it just so happened to be clean?

Less so the journalists, and more the publishers. At least, I think. At least I hope.

Outside rarely does real writing these days. My friend worked there for a bit. One of their sponsors/advertisers asked that, if they're going to pay them to show their ads, then they can't publish anything to do with death, rape, or tragedy. So my friend's boss sent out a memo saying essentially that no sad stuff could get published.

Not too long ago I was doing some deep digging and found an old copy of Runners World. I read a fantastic article from the 90s. Way lengthier than anything they've published recently and very well written. It was about Gabe Jenning's own transcon-esque journey to find a capoeira master.

I'm sure there's plenty of journalists who would love to write something more genuine, but the publisher wants nothing but to maximize ad revenue.

Will — I believe this doesn’t all add up too. But please, explain HOW the guy pulled this off. Give us your best theory on WHAT happened on the suspicious days. We all know the heart rate is sketchy. He doesn’t seemingly have the pedigree or training. Didn’t wear the tracker. And on.

So then how did he pull off this run? This can’t be that complicated. You have the background and have looked hard at this. You witnessed the guy. You agree it wasn’t watch muling. Then what was it?? No Ks that were suspicious. XX days that were clean. Just English description how the deception was pulled off.

Give us a single unified theory on the cheat code.

I think there's plenty of fair criticism of Will C but I think that demanding he have some grand unified theory on exactly what they're doing is totally unfair. He can't be the jury, judge, and the executioner. There's too many potential routes.

* Someone here figured out how to fake runs with a bike pretty convincingly

* My friend suggested maybe he was gently spinning a stationary bike inside the RV to at least try to keep his HR and cadence looking somewhat realistic

* Maybe they're watch muling but someone in that crew is a true genetic freak with a super low HR

* Manipulating a gpx file is easy peasy

* Intentionally obfuscating the HR data collected by the watch. If a lot of it is clearly junk, then why look into it? Can't trust optical HR monitors, right?

I'm sure there's more options out there.

We saw this kind of angle in the Litton thread, the narrative goes "if you can't give every detail of how it was done then it must be legit", when people offered valid suggestions, trolls and sockpuppets piled in with claims that were simply nitpicking. Other people chimed in with bogus "accomplice" theories, same thing happened with Rossi and then Meza - any number of people suggested he (Meza) was biking between mats but the nitpickers, trolls and sockpuppets would want more and more details and nonsense about accomplices. Right until the smoking gun photo of Meza on a bike in a marathon was unearthed - then they vanished. The onus of proof is not on the sceptic.

We know that WG had a supervised period of dodgy HR data running alongside RB. WC thinks it was deliberately done.

Following this thought, I think the low HR data is obfuscation to mask somebody else doing stints of running for WG. He has runners on his team who could, in theory, be all over the place doing spells of running for him. Without a tracker you could never really have a 'gotcha' moment. They then stitch the data together later on.

On days he actually needs to run (supervised) the entire thing he just does it. And his performances and fatigue levels reflect it.

At this point y'all are spinning your wheels.

Has anyone requested the watch data files for analysis, and has the team put out an official statement concerning the watch data files and when and who they will release them to?

Time is ticking, and the sooner the team releases the data to an independent expert the more credible it will be.

I also find it interesting that Will G has yet to send out cease and desist letters, or file a complaint for defamation. Why the hell wouldn't he sue if this thing was legit and he busted his ass to accomplish the transcon? I would certainly sue if my creditability and integrity was called into question. The could fund it through GoFundMe, or through its sponsors. However, that would, of course, subject WG and his team to formal discovery and depositions and then they'd have to release the data files.

The “angle” is trying to figure this out. Parroting the same thing isn’t helpful. They aren’t gonna release the data.

This makes sense to me. Appreciate the thoughts.

Jakob ran a 3:51.30 mile at 18, just saying…

This "angle" has been shown to not work - even when people suggest the exact method.

I’ll ask one question and go away. I ask because I respect you and genuinely want to know your opinion.

Of the reported 3,100 miles, about how how many miles do you believe Goodge legitimately ran?

Percentage ran. Whatever. Just still trying to get a sense of what may have been real.

Exactly how I remember that thread. There were one or two trolls (probably Kip) who kept harping on the "how". We knew it wasn't legit, too many missed timing mats and race photos. The poster kept implying that if you can't explain the how, then it must be legit, blah blah blah. And yeah, it shifted the conversation away from the specifics of what transpired to overly complicated theories about accomplices and what not.

If anyone came up with a list of 20 theories about how Goodge and his crew are are doing it, most if not all of the theories will be wrong. It's a suckers game. It's not on Will C. or anyone else to figure out "how." It's a distraction tactic, plain and simple.

thank you, I agree. It's sordid and pulls us into the weeds. Once tampering of equipment occurs and you now don't need to show a tracker or a human pulse, one can easily pull of a Transcon from a garage in Duluth. And there must be loads of different ways to mess with the watch. WGs defenders - albeit unwittingly - give a few, like suncream, cloth and an oddly shaped wrist.

I got my son to take his off just now whilst walking the dog, and it kept reading a pulse of 95 to 105 for quite a good while. This surprised us. To paraphrase Marcus Brody about the Lost Ark, wrist monitors are "not something to be taken lightly. No one knows their secrets." Treat them with respect and they work fine, despite what Huber and his professor say, or 'Appropriate language' with his constant and hostile urgings for me to back off and stop looking at this.

Truth is, once a real expert speaks, the whole thing will be blown out the water. But this takes time, money and patience.

As for the person who says we're spinning our wheels, nonsense - defeatist trash. We've come a long way and have had some huge breakthroughs, some of which Huber tragically chose to ignore. But the next reporter might dig a little deeper. Huber directly states this was no deep dive - as no interest to his readers.

But sleuths send me interesting titbits all the time. I am currently a tad backed up with it. And as of today, I now know of four major broadcasters around the world all looking at this.

According to brief snippets from his Whoop commercials, about 65-75%.

Thanks Will. That seems completely reasonable and would explain a lot. I hope the truth comes out. Appreciate you shining a light on this.