Fun to watch. All of the segment record runners are in VaporFly
Fun to watch. All of the segment record runners are in VaporFly
common sense wrote:
I like this site a lot, but seriously, all this free marketing for Nike shoes remains incredible annoying and should be stopped immediately.
It's very easy to say the shoes did all the work when actually nearly everyone was wearing them. Nevertheless on day 2 some nobody broke a long-standing CR wearing apparently NB shoes, so what's the explanation all those Nike fanboys have to offer on this case?:
It's not just the vaporfly. Other shoe companies are now copying them. Take a look at those white shoes. They are gigantic.
The point of the post isn't to promote or focus on nike. It's to point out that the new shoes have made all historical time comparisons totally meaningless.
I do think what happened in 2016 was "mechanical doping" as only a select few in the Olympic marathon had the shoes. But when 19 of the 21 teams are wearing them now, it's just about whether or not you want to allow the old times to be destroyed or not.
Yeah, the only way the 2 hr. barrier will ever be breached in a race is with the new shoe tech. New tech is good- esp. for hobby joggers, but it will cheapen all records set from when the 4%s, came out, IMO. It will be the same when they downsize it for track. They guy even says it was the shoes.
It's like in pro golf: 300+ yard drive, PW into the green. Ho-Hum. It's just not as fun to watch the pros anymore, but the new tech helps us duffers have more fun at the game. :)
Lets hire the Japanese to cover Boston, Chicago and NY marathons, they are peerless!
They show PBs of the runners, detailed splits, even the grade of an uphill, and they focus on the winning sprints, not some celebrity jogger, and the excitement in their voices makes it fun, yes fun!
Yeah, the thing people are missing is that the more prevalent carbon plate shoes become, the less of an advantage they are because everyone is wearing them. That seems to be the case now. It's not just Nike that has a carbon plate shoe. Times get faster, but if everyone wears them there is no competitive advantage.
Exactly. Shoe technology has and always will improve. Try running in some spikes from 1950
What the hell happened at the 1:30:03 mark, the image freezes but the audio keeps going??
ex-runner wrote:
Exactly. Shoe technology has and always will improve. Try running in some spikes from 1950
https://www.kshs.org/cool/graphics/santeeshoe.png
Yes but there has to be a line drawn somewhere as this most organic and natural of activities becomes more dependent of technology and therefore money. Tell me would you be happy if trainers eventually evolved into a similar product to what Oscar Pistorius wears?
roscoe. wrote:
ex-runner wrote:
Exactly. Shoe technology has and always will improve. Try running in some spikes from 1950
https://www.kshs.org/cool/graphics/santeeshoe.pngYes but there has to be a line drawn somewhere as this most organic and natural of activities becomes more dependent of technology and therefore money. Tell me would you be happy if trainers eventually evolved into a similar product to what Oscar Pistorius wears?
you really think everyone's going to run around on two foot stilts?
worst argument in this thread.
The Vaporfly's are going nowhere so the whining is just irritating now. Just accept that we are now in the post-VF era and adjust your expectations. You can't compare today's times with those from 2015 and we need to think of 2:02-2:03 as the new normal for elite marathoners.
sortie magics wrote:
Holy wow. I thought the Japanese all wore Japan-only racing flats by Asics or Mizuno such as the Sortie Magic and that sort of suited their running action which seemed less "bouncy" than the Africans and Europeans. I am amazed that the Japanese are now also using the vaporfly's. This is unprecendented in shoe technology; it's a total global takeover by Nike in shoe performance enhancement. I am almost tempted to try them myself ....
I used to think the same: that Japanese pros wore mostly asics and some Mizuno. However, it's been obvious to me for a year or two that nearly all Japanese who are sponsored and good enough to be on my radar (close enough to the front of big marathons to be in the camera shot for example) wear Nike. Not sure how new this is, but I can't name a non-Nike Japanese other than Kawauchi.
Mondo tracks are a product of technology. They, like carbon plate shoes, are designed for energy return and the resulting fast times. Why are you not complaining about modern tracks? Would you like a return to dirt tracks -- can't beat how "natural" they are? How about bamboo pole vault poles? Those were pretty "natural" too.
Les wrote:
Mondo tracks are a product of technology. They, like carbon plate shoes, are designed for energy return and the resulting fast times. Why are you not complaining about modern tracks? Would you like a return to dirt tracks -- can't beat how "natural" they are? How about bamboo pole vault poles? Those were pretty "natural" too.
I think it's the suddenness of the change in this case. Essentially overnight a shoe changed the sport and marathon times dropped 2-3 minutes. I cant think of anything that has precipitated such a dramatic change in performance in such a short time other than PEDs. Its weird for me to look at my times from 4 years ago and say if only I had the shoes I'd have been 2 minutes faster.
Nike has a new hakone ekiden themed colorway of some of their shoes in case you want to celebrate this historic race.
ooper wrote:
boing, boing... a disgrace.
We'll run out of asterisks to attach to all these times at this rate. The sooner these things are banned the better.
Yes. But unfortunately, there are coaches who do not want them banned.
asdfdsag wrote:
roscoe. wrote:
Yes but there has to be a line drawn somewhere as this most organic and natural of activities becomes more dependent of technology and therefore money. Tell me would you be happy if trainers eventually evolved into a similar product to what Oscar Pistorius wears?
you really think everyone's going to run around on two foot stilts?
worst argument in this thread.
Those white straps around the foot was cheating. I graduated from high school in 1976 and did not have those advantages. Your point is poor though because I could have used tape. Also, many records have been set since Paavo Nurmi ran. Do you think tracks, medicine, and a myriad of other things have not been improved by then?
WE do not want 12-year-old girls running the 4-minute mile. It's common sense!
Lets put it to a vote.
Allow CheaterFlys to exist (YES, you can do whatever you want to the shoe.)
Ban CheaterFlys (NO, the shoe must be checked for all competitions.)
Ban cheatflies and similarly advantageous models.
Just as track's energy return is limited by IAAF statute, so too should the shoe's energy return.
Those “white shoes” with a bit of a high top are Mizunos new wave duel neo - a carbon/foam prototype.
Les wrote:
Mondo tracks are a product of technology. They, like carbon plate shoes, are designed for energy return and the resulting fast times. Why are you not complaining about modern tracks? Would you like a return to dirt tracks -- can't beat how "natural" they are? How about bamboo pole vault poles? Those were pretty "natural" too.
Don't be dumb. The point is everyone races on the same track whereas you have to be a Nike athlete (Or be willing to screw over your sponsors) to race in the VFs. A closer analogy would be if a subset of athletes got to run in tartan lanes while others had to run on dirt on the same track.
