OC Marathon winner DQ'd - Stephen Shay WINS

I still question why race officials let the guy on the bike stay in the race for so long (was he there the whole time?). Doesn't any decent race have an official vehicle (or at least a bicycle) with the race leader?

There is another article on this topic in the oc register today. The guy who was disqualified said he did not know the rule. The official cyclist leading the runners got a flat tire and fell behind the runners so he claims his friend on the bike was making sure he was staying on the course. A couple years ago the lead woman at the oc marathon went off course.

Not sure I'm buying that. The DQ'd guy was second last year so was familiar with the course. Also, it sounds like the biker was told that is was not legal to be out there but he kept going. See the below video that made the local news.http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/05/07/record-breaking-oc-marathon-winner-disqualified-for-getting-aid-during-race/

Ryan Atwood wrote:

There is another article on this topic in the oc register today. The guy who was disqualified said he did not know the rule. The official cyclist leading the runners got a flat tire and fell behind the runners so he claims his friend on the bike was making sure he was staying on the course. A couple years ago the lead woman at the oc marathon went off course.

I don't disagree that the offence can result in a DQ. I just would not have pushed the issue if I was in second.

SEX BATMAN wrote:

Jean Paul wasn't disqualified in the New York Marathon when he mistakenly drank Kramer's *tea* instead of the water cup. I call bulls***.

Mmmmm ... okay, after seeing the video, it seems like the winner and his coach definitely deserve the DQ. Bush league.

Here is the problem.

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the video was brought to his attention Monday by Nathan Shay, the brother of runner-up Stephan Shay.

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It just comes off as dirty when a family member has to cry foul.

I agree he should have been disqualified but wanted to let his perspective be heard. He is saying he will defend his title next year so he still is claiming it as a victory.

DQ'd runner says he will 'defend title' next year

Mohamed Fadil said he didn’t know he was breaking the rules by getting aid and water from cyclist during the OC Marathon.

Mohamed Fadil was already home in Albuquerque, N.M., two days after setting a new course record at the OC Marathon, when the phone rang.

“I hadn’t heard about any protest; I was flying back home,” the 32-year-old elite runner said in a phone interview Wednesday. “When I got the call, it hurt.”

Fadil finished the 26.2-mile course that runs through four Orange County cities in 2:21:42, besting the record set in 2011 by Peter Omae Ayieni of Kenya by 1 minute, 3 seconds.

As he crossed the finish line at the Orange County fairgrounds, Fadil kissed his right index finger and held it to the sky. He had beaten runner-up Stephan Shay, 27, of Huntington Beach by 1 minute, 27 seconds, but he had broken the rules to get there.

Video evidence sent in to race officials by Shay’s brother – who was watching the race from the sidelines – showed Fadil getting aid from a friend who rode alongside the runner on a bicycle, pacing Fadil and giving him fluids on the course.

Both are against USA Track and Field’s Rule 144 dealing with illegally aiding a runner.

Fadil acknowledged that his friend was cycling alongside him and gave him water, but he claims he did not know either were violations.

“In my mind, I am the winner of the OC Marathon,” Fadil said. “I didn’t cheat. Even if they took it off the paper, I am the winner.”

The problem arose around mile 13, when Fadil said one of the official cyclists in the race – who typically ride ahead of the racers to make sure they stay on course – got a flat tire.

Shortly after, Fadil’s cyclist friend came alongside him. Even though he had run the course last year, Fadil said he was worried he would take a wrong turn, and asked the cyclist to lead him along the course since the official cyclist had fallen behind.

“He told me he knew the course, and he was just doing the same thing the lead cyclist would normally do on the course,” Fadil said.

It wouldn’t have been the first time a runner felt confused on the OC Marathon course. In the 2011 race, Glimber Ayala and Natalie Stein ran the wrong direction for the last 3 miles of the race. At the time, race officials said Stein would have taken first in the women’s marathon if she hadn’t veered off course.

As for getting fluids from his friend, Fadil said he was unaware that was an issue.

“The water stations were all along the road, every mile or so – I would have just taken it from them if I would have known,” Fadil said.

But Shay, the runner-up later declared the winner, said the constant access to water can make a big difference.

“I have to wait for water stations to get fluids, and he has it right next to him the whole time, so it’s a big advantage,” Shay said.

The video footage gave race director Gary Kutscher strong evidence, but he said it was still a tough decision to disqualify a winner based on information sent in by the brother of the race’s runner-up.

“My lead cyclist got a flat out there, but whether he gets a flat tire or not, someone off the course cannot come in to guide someone around the course, and cannot be giving a runner water,” Kutscher said.

As the race is a USA Track and Field-sanctioned event, Kutscher said the runners are responsible for knowing the rules.

With only three marathons under his belt, Fadil is somewhat new to the race length, but not the sport. He has been racing professionally in 10K and half marathons since 2001.

“In talking with him, I honestly don’t believe he knew he was breaking those rules, but he should have known better, and it was a costly mistake,” Kutscher said.

Fadil was runner-up in the 2013 OC Marathon, and plans on coming back next year.

“I enjoy the course, and want to come back and defend my title,” Fadil said.

In the video by mile 23, there was another bike (i assume the lead bike) that was escorting Fadil. If his friend was just there to help out while there was a flat, maybe that would be less of an issue. In this case, it looked like he continued on for the majority of the race. The fact that Shay's brother had to point it out should be of no consequence as it was a violation. And to be honest, many people not familiar with running might not even know. Given his brother probably is aware of what should go on, it is really not surprising that he was the one who caught it.

He makes it sound as though it is a technical rule -- say an oversized logo -- with no effect on performance. How could he not, as someone who's raced since 2001, not understand that having a friend cycle next to him with fluid bottles at the ready (note that the guy on the bike has the bottles in a fluid belt presumably ready to give them) was an advantage over the other racers?

MikeM wrote:

The fact that Shay's brother had to point it out should be of no consequence as it was a violation. And to be honest, many people not familiar with running might not even know. Given his brother probably is aware of what should go on, it is really not surprising that he was the one who caught it.

^^^^This

If Fadil wanted his coach/friend to insure he stayed on the proper course after the race's lead biker got a flat he should have sent his coach/friend up ahead 50 yards or 100 yards or something like that and not had him pace from right next to him and hand him bottles along the way. If they had done it that way I don't see how the race could call for a DQ, unless race officials expressly told the coach/friend to get off the course, at which time it is easy for the coach/friend to tell the officials that the lead biker had a flat and ask to take over the role. If I'm the RD and that's the case I tell the guy to go get it done. But not from right next to the guy he knows!

As for accepting drinks from unofficial aid stations, if you're in position to win $ you need to know what rules the race is operating under. If not, assume it's USATF/IAAF rules and you can only take a drink at official stations. That's racing 101. They way I always saw it is if somebody is offering drinks or orange slices in their front yard, to any runner who comes along, then no problem taking some. But if it's something that is only being offered to a specific runner or group of runners then if you take you run the risk of getting called for doing so.

As for Malcolm Richards, he and I exchanged emails a few days ago, just some minor injuries that have him at less than 100%. He's getting back on track and hopes to run some good races this summer and a fast marathon this fall. Too bad OC didn't work out I'd have loved to see what he could do on that course.

d2xccoach wrote:

As for accepting drinks from unofficial aid stations, if you're in position to win $ you need to know what rules the race is operating under. If not, assume it's USATF/IAAF rules and you can only take a drink at official stations. That's racing 101. They way I always saw it is if somebody is offering drinks or orange slices in their front yard, to any runner who comes along, then no problem taking some. But if it's something that is only being offered to a specific runner or group of runners then if you take you run the risk of getting called for doing so.

Calling BS on that one. Elites hand off bottles to their running partners all the time without being dq'd.

I've even watched races like the Berlin Marathon where the RD has assigned a biker to accompany the eventual winner and feed her drinks along the course. No dq's there either.

Either enforce the rule or do away with it.

So Berlin is governed by USATF rules? You have a small sample bias and didn't even mention a sample from the right population. FAILRegardless, the rule says it's ok if it's given by an official. So if the RD has ok'd the biker, it becomes an "official" source. I'm guessing because you mentioned Berlin this was done for a World Record attempt; which obviously means they know that being handed water by a biker saves time by not having to go over to a water station and prevents the athlete from potentially missing a water stop or someone else taking their fluids, which does happen in elite races.

Gimpy McGimpster wrote:

I've even watched races like the Berlin Marathon where the RD has assigned a biker to accompany the eventual winner and feed her drinks along the course. No dq's there either.

Ze Germanz wrote:

So Berlin is governed by USATF rules? You have a small sample bias and didn't even mention a sample from the right population. FAIL

Regardless, the rule says it's ok if it's given by an official. So if the RD has ok'd the biker, it becomes an "official" source. I'm guessing because you mentioned Berlin this was done for a World Record attempt; which obviously means they know that being handed water by a biker saves time by not having to go over to a water station and prevents the athlete from potentially missing a water stop or someone else taking their fluids, which does happen in elite races.

Gimpy McGimpster wrote:

I've even watched races like the Berlin Marathon where the RD has assigned a biker to accompany the eventual winner and feed her drinks along the course. No dq's there either.

ye unworldly, hick. its a universal rule that is rarely enforced. iaaf's version: (e) An athlete who collects refreshment from a place other than the refreshment stations renders himself liable to disqualification.

enforce it or do away with the rule.

It was enforced and the article cited a USATF rule for the decision, not an IAAF one

I examined the race and what evidence there was and made the following observations:

Cyclist was first seen ~mile 13, Stephan Shay said the cyclist paced Mohamed most of the course.

Nathan Shay brother of Stephan Shay can be heard and seen heckling/harassing/intimidating the cyclist and Mohamed at around mile 13 calling him a cheater and will be DQ'ed.

Around the halfway point Mohamed pulls away from Stephan Shay for the next 10 miles gaining at least a half mile lead. Mohamed stated that he was using the race as a training run.

~ mile 15 the only lead cyclist got a flat tire then the other cyclist took the duty to pace and lead and assistance with directions for the lead runner.

As per Rule 243 of USTAF(d) "A lead vehicle should be provided with additional vehicles to assist in monitoring

the competition, timing, or other required functions." The cyclist took on the duty of lead vehicle to escort the leader.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

USTAF Rule RULE 243

COURSE MARKING AND MONITORING

1. Running courses shall be adequately marked at strategic points to keep the competitors

on course.

(a) Each turn and intersection shall be clearly marked in such a way that there will be no

doubt as to the direction the runner should go to stay on course.

(b) Distance markers should be located throughout the course. It is recommended that

markers be placed at maximum intervals of 3 to 5km or 2 to 3 miles. The spacing of

their intervals shall be determined by the Games Committee.

(c) The measurement line should be marked along the course in a distinctive color that

cannot be mistaken for other markings.

(d) The finish line in off-track long distance running events should be a line of width

15cm in a color contrasting the running surface and of a material which will adhere

to a fixed position on the running surface. The exact finish line shall be clearly

marked and stated in competitor instructions in order to eliminate confusion with

designs on or adjacent to the running surface near the finish line. The use of a tape,

held by individuals not serving as judges, may be used to help identify the location

of the finish line.

2. Turns and major intersections on the course shall be monitored.

(a) Monitors shall always be standing and shall be located at or before the change of

direction, not after it occurs on the course.

(b) Scorers shall keep a record of the runners and their running times at specific points

on the course.

(c) Whenever possible, the route of the competition should be free of vehicular traffic or

nearly so. All dangerous intersections should be staffed to provide for traffic and

spectator control.

(d) A lead vehicle should be provided with additional vehicles to assist in monitoring

the competition, timing, or other required functions.

(e) Whenever possible, elapsed times should be displayed or read at various points

along the running course for the benefit of the runners and to record such time

intervals.

2014 USATF Competition Rules ● 130

3. Runner's identification shall consist of running numbers pinned securely on the front of

each runner's uniform and displayed throughout the race. The registration list will contain

each runner's name and running number.

4. Any competitor who has been found by the Referee and/or Jury of Appeal to have gained

an unfair advantage by intentionally shortening the route of the race ("cutting the course")

shall be immediately disqualified from the competition. See also Rule 163.6.

_____________________________________________________________________________________

~ mile 21 lead cyclist fixed tire and went to lead to lead front runners, other cyclist dropped to the back of the leader, Mohamed

~mile 24 altercation between cyclist and Nathan Shay. Cyclist says he wanted to direct attention and protect the lead runner from the heckling and harassment and intimidating nature of Nathan and to see what his issue is. Note this is the second time Nathan has harassed the lead runner. Not all the video has been released showing the cyclist telling Nathan he should seek anger management is one thing not seen. The media seems to show a heavily skewed side on behalf of Stephan Shay who's late great brothers birthday happened to be on the day of the race.

~mile 25.5 cyclist leaves Mohamed leaving only Mohamed and the other lead cyclist to the finish, Stephan Shay no where in sight.

FACT CHECK:

A total of 2-3 times did the cyclist give water to Mohamed when he was near an aid station. A referee never issued any warning or caution whatsoever as USATF RULE 144 dictates must happen before a DQ can be made. As Mohamed testified he was not aware of the complete USATF RULEBOOK and did not know he was doing anything wrong, nor did any referee tell him or warn him. Its easier to believe Mohamed who's english isn't 100% then it is to believe the brother of the second place runner.

For ~12.5 miles the cyclist can be seen with Mohamed, ~5 miles of which was acting as a stand in lead pacer because back in 2011. According to the Register report, in 2011, Glimber Ayala and Natalie Stein ran the wrong direction on the course for the final three miles. Come on OC Marathon get it together.

If 3.8 seconds per mile is the advantage of a pacer times 12.5 miles at the maximum or 7.5 miles at the minimum (subtracting the lead duty)

then 3.8 times 12.5 = 47.5 seconds maxium and 3.8 seconds times 7.5 = 28.5 seconds minimum. 28.5 seconds - 47.5 seconds would have been a possible advantage since Stephan Shay was second by over a minute, he still would not have beaten the winner Mohamed.

__________________________________________________________________________________

Allegations for DQ

RULE 144

ASSISTANCE TO ATHLETES

1. Competition under these Rules consists of self-propelled motion without assistance,

except as defined by the Rules of Competition of a specific event discipline.

NOTE: For rules covering disabled-only competitions see the SPECIAL SECTION

which follows ILLUSTRATIONS in this rule book.

2. Except as provided in road races (Rule 241) and in long distance walking events (Rule

232), during the progress of an event a competitor who has received any assistance

whatsoever may be disqualified by the Referee. “Assistance” is the conveying of advice,

information or direct help to an athlete by any means, including a technical device.

3. The following shall be considered examples of assistance:

(a) Pacing in running or walking events by persons not participating in the event, by

competitors lapped or about to be lapped, or by any kind of technical device other

than those permitted under Rule 144.3i.

(b) The visible possession or use by athletes of video, audio, or communications devices

in the competition area. The Games Committee for an LDR event may allow the use

of portable listening devices not capable of receiving communication; however,

those competing in championships for awards, medals, or prize money may not use

such devices.

(c) The use of any technology or appliance that provides the user with an unfair

advantage which would not have been obtainable using equipment complying with

the Rules.

NOTE: Shoes complying with Rule 143 are permitted.

The following shall not be considered assistance:

(d) Verbal or other communication, without the use of any technical device, from an

individual who is not in the competition area to an athlete who is in the competition

area. In order to facilitate this communication and not to disturb the staging of the

competition, it is recommended that a place in the stands, close to the immediate site

of each field event, be reserved for the athletes’ coaches.

(e) Physiotherapy and/or medical treatment necessary to enable an athlete to participate,

or continue participation once in the competition area, may be provided by members

of the official medical staff appointed by the Games Committee and clearly

identified as such. Accredited team medical personnel approved by the Meet Doctor

specifically for this purpose may be permitted in the medical treatment area outside

the competition area. In neither case shall the intervention delay the conduct of the

competition or a competitor’s trial in the designated order.

(f) Medical personnel authorized by the Games Committee or Referee to do so may

perform a hands-on medical examination during the progress of an event for any

athlete who appears in distress. If in their opinion it is in the best interest of the

athlete’s health and welfare, they may remove the athlete from the competition.

(g) Any kind of personal safeguard (i.e., bandage, tape, belt, support, etc.) for medical

purposes. The Referee shall have the authority to verify any case should that be

desired.

(h) Pace setting by an officially designated person entered in an event for that purpose is

permitted, provided such pacesetters start in the event.

(i) Carrying or wearing articles of personal equipment such as wrist chronometers and

heart rate monitors, speed distance monitors or stride sensors provided that such

device cannot be used to communicate with any other person.

4. In a track event, any competitor competing to lose or to coach another competitor shall

forfeit the right to be in the competition and shall be disqualified.

2014 USATF Competition Rules ● 55

5. In a field event, an athlete may not leave the immediate area of the event and engage in

dialogue with persons outside the area.

NOTE: Athletes competing in an event on the infield may not, during the competition,

cross to the outside of the track.

6. Any athlete giving or receiving assistance during any event other than permitted in Rule

144.3 must be cautioned by the Referee and warned that for any repetition, he or she will

be disqualified from that event. If such disqualification occurs, any performance

accomplished up to that time in the same event session shall not be considered valid.

Performances accomplished in any previous event session, such as a qualifying round,

shall stand.

NOTE 1: For Youth Athletics exception, see Rule 302.5(j).

NOTE 2: Information conveyed to an athlete by an official is not considered assistance

provided such information is made available to all athletes.

7. Intermediate times and preliminary winning times may be officially announced and/or

displayed. Otherwise such times must not be communicated to the athletes by persons in

the competition area without the prior approval of the Referee. This permission shall only

be given when there are no time displays visible to athletes at the relevant point and in

circumstances where such times will be provided to all athletes in the race.

8. No attendant or competitor who is not actually taking part in the competition shall

accompany any competitor on the mark or in the competition, nor shall any competitor be

allowed, without the permission of the Referee or Judges, to receive assistance or

refreshment from anyone during the progress of the competition, except as provided by

Rules 144.3(b), 144.9, 232, or 241.

9. (a) In races of 5000 Meters through 10,000 Meters, the meet organizers may furnish

competitors with water and sponging stations on the track and in off-track events.

(b) In Track Events longer than 10,000m, water shall be provided and sponging stations

may be provided. Refreshments may be provided either by the Games Committee or

the athlete and shall be placed so that they are easily accessible to, or may be put by

authorized persons into the hands of the athletes. Refreshments provided by the

athletes shall be kept under the supervision of officials designated by the Games

Committee from the time that the refreshments are lodged by the athletes or their

representatives. See Rules 232 and 241.

RULE 145

DISQUALIFICATION

1. If an athlete is disqualified in an event because of an infringement of the USATF

Competition Rules, reference to the USATF Rule infringed shall be made in the official

results. Any performance accomplished up to that time in the same session of the event

shall not be considered valid. Performances accomplished in any previous event session,

such as a qualifying round, or previous events of a combined event, shall stand. This

disqualification shall not prevent an athlete from participating in any future event.

2. Any competitor who shall refuse to obey the directions of the Referee or other proper

official, or who shall conduct himself/herself in an unsportsmanlike manner, or who is

offensive by action or language to the officials, spectators, or competitors at any

competition may be disqualified by the Referee from future competition at the meet. If

such disqualification occurs, any performance accomplished up to that time in the same

event session shall not be considered valid. Performances accomplished in any previous

event session, such as a qualifying round or previous events of a combined event, shall 2014 USATF Competition Rules ● 56

stand. If the Referee thinks the offense worthy of additional action, he/she shall promptly

make detailed statement of the offense to the appropriate National or Association Officer.

3. If an athlete is cited for a second (or subsequent) time under Rule 125.8 for acting in an

unsporting or improper manner, in different rounds of one event, or in different events,

the athlete shall be disqualified from such second (or subsequent) events in accordance

with this Rule.

________________________________________________________________

As per USATF RULE 144 section 3, a referee must caution the athlete being given assistance and for any repetition they will be disqualified for from the event. At no time during the race was the cyclist or Mohamed given a warning from any referee rendering the disqualification unwarranted and void as per USATF RULE 144.3 and 145.2

6. Any athlete giving or receiving assistance during any event other than permitted in Rule

144.3 must be cautioned by the Referee and warned that for any repetition, he or she will

be disqualified from that event. If such disqualification occurs, any performance

accomplished up to that time in the same event session shall not be considered valid.

Performances accomplished in any previous event session, such as a qualifying round,

shall stand.

2. Any competitor who shall refuse to obey the directions of the Referee or other proper

official, or who shall conduct himself/herself in an unsportsmanlike manner, or who is

offensive by action or language to the officials, spectators, or competitors at any

competition may be disqualified by the Referee from future competition at the meet. If

such disqualification occurs, any performance accomplished up to that time in the same

event session shall not be considered valid. Performances accomplished in any previous

event session, such as a qualifying round or previous events of a combined event, shall

stand. If the Referee thinks the offense worthy of additional action, he/she shall promptly

make detailed statement of the offense to the appropriate National or Association Officer.

__________________________________________________________________________________

Upon completion of the race, Nathan Shay (brother of second place Stephan Shay) protested the winner Mohamed Fadil and show video evidence for the protest. The decision seemed to be made rather prematurely, claiming Stephan Shay the winner without hearing the full story. An appeal was made on Mohamed's behalf. Under no circumstances would the cyclist have ridden near or been at the race had he known it would have resulted in the disqualification of Mohamed nor if Mohamed was aware of the rule would he have allowed it either.

Who was fitter?

Well we know Mohamed just came off a 1:04 half marathon in Hollywood and Stephan just came of at 2:24 marathon in LA which would put Mohamed at a 2:16 marathon time when calculated on the McMillan running calculator compared to 2:24 by Shay, give or take.

The OC Marathon needs to make corrections in the following:

a) there should have been more then one lead cyclist as the lead vehicle

b) a warning from a referee must be made before a DQ can be placed as per USATF RULE 144.3 and RULE 145.2. More referees need to be on the course, or a complete race video of the leaders would be great as well

c) the RD should have heard all sides of the story before making the decision

d) an elite table aid station should be set up for future events

e) if the course was USATF certified it should not have been 26.6 miles long.

f)Interesting to note that Stephan Shays prize money for second place would have been 2750 (750 for second place overall and 2000 for Cal Edge program) and Mohamed's would have been 2000 for first no it is Stephan Shay at 4000 and Mohamed at 0. Heavily skewed in favor of Stephan.

g) What makes a better story for publicity for the OC Marathon, a relatively unknown runner wins the marathon or the brother of late great Ryan Shay winning the OC Marathon on the birthday of Ryan?

h) if the OC Marathon wants to compete with other elite marathons and bring in a solid elite field they need to make some changes

Conclusion:

Either way it appears Fadil was the faster runner at the end of the day and would have won regardless. A referee or some other official should keep the lead runners free from bikes and any other vehicles or people that would interfere with the race. A complete DQ seems to be unwarranted from an overall standpoint.

ALL TOTAL BS.

He broke the rules and that does warrant a DQ.

As someone else posted, looks like there is more to the story here and I'm calling BS on your post. Looks like the DQ was more than justified. https://www.facebook.com/shayfitnessplanNot sure how warning someone about breaking the rules can be interpreted as harassment when in fact that person did break the rules and was DQ'd. From this post it doesn't look like his brother saw the biker till mile 16 so not sure where the mile 13 comment came from.Based on the above link, it looks like he had plenty of warnings. If your comeback to this is that it wasn't an "official warning", might I ask what "official" gave the cyclist permission to become the "lead vehicle"?Glad you posted the whole rule because it looks like there is a unsportsman like conduct rule in there which the cyclist clearly violated. Looks like the cyclist was the one getting into peoples faces and name calling.If the lead biker was back on course at mile 21 as you say (though Shay's post says the leader was back on course by mile 16) then there is no reason for the cyclist to be on the course after that. As anyone who's run a marathon knows, this is the most critical part of the race and receiving any kind of benefit at that point is an unfair advantage. In the video online, the cyclist riding along side Mohamed at mile 24 so don't know how this would be considered "dropping back". He should have just got off the course.I don't see how you can see the DQ was premature. It wasn't announced till Tuesday and the articles said the race director talked with Mohamed on the phone and he admitted he received pacing and fluids.I agree with a lot of your recommendations about improvements in the race, but how is the prize money relevant? The allocation was set up before the race so not sure how that is skewed in anyone's favor except for if you're a California resident or not. It's not like that was created for any one individual, but rather to promote all California runners.Is there other video posted somewhere that the rest of can see? Where's the mile 13 video you mentioned?