What the Hell Happened to Michigan's Track Program?

Where is Dallas Bowden?

If Gibby could recruit and develop good teams at William & Mary, why wouldn't he be able to do it at Michigan? He should be able to get better quality recruits at Michigan than at W&M. If they develop similarly to his W&M guys but already have better natural talent, why shouldn't Michigan become a contender.

W&M is a great school, but so is Michigan and Michigan is in the Big Ten. I think he will do fine.

I don't know how you don't understand it.

Developing talent is different than throwing 12 guys into 115-130 miles a week hammering everyday and getting 3 or 4 strong guys. That is what Gibby did at W&M.

This works in XC because you get can 3 or 4 guys who can run close to 30:00 in XC and they can carry the team to nationals every year.

This also works in mediocre track conferences like the CAA because you can sweep the 5k and 10k, get a ton of points and win the meet or finish 2nd.

You cannot have success at the Big 10 meet by running a 130 mile a week meat grinder program and trying to sweep the 10k.

Name ONE middle distance runner Gibby coached while at W&M that could compete at the Big 10 level (there is none).

Ok,I will take the bait:

1) Name 12 guys running 115-130 miles a week? At W&M when Gibby was there or at MI currently?

2) Name: Ian Fitzgerald. NCAA finalist in the mile, that couldn't compete at the big 10 level I guess.

Who coached Brian Hyde?

coach d. wrote:

Who coached Brian Hyde?

Walt Drenth.

They go after kids that ran so many miles in High school to run the times that are decent but not really when you consider the fact that they had to run 90 miles a week to get those times. When you run 90 miles a week in high school only to run 15:40s, 9:20's and 4:20's you are really not that good. I know that the U of M coach passes on kids that are really quite good but because they run in the lower high school divisions he passes on him. I heard him say during the D4 race that there wasn't much there. I will make a bet that the top runners in D4 will go on to make better college runners than most of the D1 and D2 kids that he thinks are worth while.

Here is a tip for college coaches do not recruit kids from Milford, Pinkney, Dexter, or Rockford. Of all the great runners they have had in high school only Ritz, Hartman and maybe Greenless could be worthwhile college runners. The Pinkney kids almost always quit before they are done running. Go after those D4 kids they don't run all year, they don't do as much speed work, they have a much greater upside.

I disagree with your basic assumption. Why should you expect UM to compete for the Big 10 title every year? Why do you assume UM should always be among the best? Are the other school in the Big 10 not going to try nor could they possibly be good enough to compete? It is typical UM arrogance. Like most UM fans you assume success as a birthright. Why wouldn't UM track go through cycles of up and down years, success and more difficult years, like most other competitive university programs? I suggest you should hire Rich Rodriguez as your track coach. That would work out well.

I never thought Warhurst was a very good coach at all. Perhaps a great recruiter, but not a great coach. I could be wrong of course.

I did NOT attend either Ohio State or Michigan State so I have no real stake in that race. I just find UM fans to be the most arrogant and privileged I have ever had the misfortune of encountering. I do not even care about collegiate athletics, but I do find some enjoyment when UM loses. It usually gives me a chuckle when I notice it in the paper.

I think the swimming team is doing really well still.

G-D

1) Your trivializing of 800/1500 training and its (actual) complexity is laughable.

2) 31 teams are invited to the NCAA Championships every year. Among them in 2011 was the University of Michigan (after, as someone correctly pointed out, a number of years of absence). I think the attacking of the skill and/or credibility of an excellent coach here can cease immediately, and you can get back to your "meaningful" employment that you have stolen away from to post this.

eraenbd wrote:

Smorgz agreed to Michigan because they're letting him continue with his triathlon training (not going to work).

Gibby got William and Mary good on the backs of 9:25 2-milers running huge mileage and getting ready for Pre-Nationals XC, Regionals XC, NCAA XC, and then a Stanford outdoor meet to get NCAA marks. There was not a Dual meet against Ohio State and no conference meet (indoors or outdoors) that was even remotely important or competitive.

Nowadays, boy wonder has to be ready at 2 conference meets (TRACK). He better pray the AD thinks XC is an actual sport.

And losing Forys and April is huge. They have NOBODY else and will not be good at all next year! Good news is that W&M is on a downslide and perhaps Gibby can get old job back?

What about Jill Smith?

On that note, whatever happened to Danielle Tauro? She was a 4:38 miler (I think) in high school, never looked too thin, but didn't do a thing at Michigan. Apparently she's graduated now. I was in the same year as her in NJ and always assumed she'd be competing for an Olympic spot by this point.

Hard to blame Gibby given the following two facts -

1) He's only been there 18 months

2) He is not the head Track and Field coach

With the new AD and commitment to winning, I would not be surprised if LaPlante is axed sometime in the next couple of years. This is his third season and the results are disappointing so far.

As for Gibby, just getting to NCAAs this past Fall was a big step for the program, and I assume they brought him in mainly for XC and 5K/10K. Hopefully he can develop as a solid 800/1500/3000 coach too, as this is key to winning conference championships in T&F.

I'm actually ON Michigan's track team right now and its funny how people who have nothing to do with the program have strong opinions. First, let me just say that Gibby is great. We have an awesome group of guys and love running for him. He communicates well, doesn't play favorites, is supportive, and works his ass off. I can't speak to his recruiting because he's really only been here a year. I do think if he can get the caliber of recruits they have had in the past, then watch out.

Its a sad period for men's track. Seems its time to change gears. Fred has not ever been consisent in having quality teams...and while Gibby is working hard at recruiting, his training methods seem geared to a marathon not college cross or track. There has been no improvement with the guys there now. They better get the ship righted quickly, David Brandon the AD does not tolerate failure very well.

Ann Arbor is a whore.... GO BUCKS!!!

The official tree for the beautiful state of Ohio is the Buckeye, so it seems fitting that this would be the mascot of the largest university in the state.

Brutus, the mascot of Ohio State, is supposed to be the nut that grows on these trees.

Interesting. So, to be clear, a Buckeye is a shrub, and their mascot is a the left nut of that shrub? Interesting.

The truth is that the Michigan kids over the years are a bunch of prima donnas that refuse to stick their nose to the ground and do some real work. Now that Gibby is here, he found some good role models in Forys and April to lead the team out of this mess. they have come a decent way in two years and will continue to improve.

Jungle Master wrote:

The truth is that the Michigan kids over the years are a bunch of prima donnas that refuse to stick their nose to the ground and do some real work.

Just an FYI: the two idioms are "put one's nose to the grindstone" (meaning: buckle down and work) and "keep one's ear to the ground" (meaning: pay attention, watching for clues as to what's going to happen).

You're welcome.

PS--Folks may also find this info helpful: the saying is "The proof [i.e. the test] of the pudding is in the eating."

The saying is NOT "The proof is in the pudding"--a sentence which, when you think about it, makes zero sense.

Michigan is WAY down by any measure. Fred laplante needs to go. He thru Ron Warhurst under the bus.

trgclychip wrote:

Michigan is WAY down by any measure. Fred laplante needs to go. He thru Ron Warhurst under the bus.

How????? I want details!