Would Kipchoge winning Oly Marathon Gold #3 in 2024 be enough to surpass Bekele as the Distance GOAT?

There are some dense people in this thread. Yes, Kipchoge is the GOAT marathoner and no one else even comes close. But the marathon is not the only event in running.

big daddy wrote:

There are some dense people in this thread. Yes, Kipchoge is the GOAT marathoner and no one else even comes close. But the marathon is not the only event in running.

You are the one who is an idiot. You made a statement there there is nothing Kipchoge couple do in the marathon that would make him the GOAT distance runner. Again you are really stupid. IF Kipchoge ran a legitimate 1:50 marathon, he would be the GOAT distance runner in history. Please educate yourself.

big daddy wrote:

But I would like to remind a few facts here: Bekele has come within 6 seconds of the world record on TWO SEPARATE occasions, three years apart, both pre- and post-super shoes. He literally had a better marathon PR than Kipchoge for a period of two years.

I would like to remind you that in 2016 Bekele ran 2:03 in Berlin with the Vaporfly prototype that had the streak upper. Look at the race photos.

No.

Bad Wigins wrote:

Oh Please wrote:

KB has had success on three surfaces, while Kipchoge has two surfaces.

One of those surfaces doesn't count, and everyone damn well knows it. Hardly any elite runner gives a hoot about some obscure western after-school activity like golf course running. No depth of competition, easy to dominate.

It's amusing.

Because in XC, Bekele was beating the same people that were on tracks. Like Kipchoge, Sihine, Shaheen, Songok, Tadese, Mathati, Kiprop, Gebremariam, Motram

Kipchoge is clearly the greatest marathon runner ever I.e. the long distance king but across the full range of distance running Bekele has him covered easily.

Another Marathon gold will do little to push the needle but dropping back down to 10k and winning a world or Olympics title on the track against Cheptegui would be the tipping point.

Correct. He is only the greatest marathoner, which is great but far from what a goat distance runner should achieve. It's a niche event . For something like this you'd have to have a WR in one event but also have another or two or at least be very close to a WR in one or two other disciplines. Then you'd have to have to have won at least an Olympic gold in primary event but also won gold in another event, and medaled in a third. So if he had the marathon WR and the half WR while also being very close to the 5000 &10000 records then winning a gold in the marathon and 10000, silver in 5000 would qualify him in the goat discussion. Right now he's a little better than Walmsley

Then when you factor in that Kipchoge was in some of the xc races against Bekele and that every Marathon major field doesn't have all the best athletes in the world in it. it becomes clear that Bekele is by far superior.

Kipchoge is the fastest marathon runner ever and has 2 olympic Men's marathon golds..he's obviously the greatest competitive Men's marathon runner in history. He can be surpassed though.

Not a clue how to edit, or quote, so I'm adding to this by copy and pasting the original. Obviously in the Olympics the best distance athlete wins the marathon , the Olympic answer is therefore Kipchoge.

However, the most extreme distance foot race is the Self-Transcendence 3100 Mile Race and Ashprihanal Aalto holds the record for that. Until Kipchoge breaks it, then Aalto is the real distance goat. If I ever won the Olympic marathon, my next step would be entering Self-Transcedence and trying to break its record tbh.

need more information wrote:

big daddy wrote:

But I would like to remind a few facts here: Bekele has come within 6 seconds of the world record on TWO SEPARATE occasions, three years apart, both pre- and post-super shoes. He literally had a better marathon PR than Kipchoge for a period of two years.

I would like to remind you that in 2016 Bekele ran 2:03 in Berlin with the Vaporfly prototype that had the streak upper. Look at the race photos.

important fact if true. it still does little to change the overall picture though... Kipchoge could run a freaking 1:50 if he wanted and all it would do is cement his status as GOAT marathoner. he already had his chance on the track.

masked avenger wrote:

Correct. He is only the greatest marathoner, which is great but far from what a goat distance runner should achieve. It's a niche event . For something like this you'd have to have a WR in one event but also have another or two or at least be very close to a WR in one or two other disciplines. Then you'd have to have to have won at least an Olympic gold in primary event but also won gold in another event, and medaled in a third. So if he had the marathon WR and the half WR while also being very close to the 5000 &10000 records then winning a gold in the marathon and 10000, silver in 5000 would qualify him in the goat discussion. Right now he's a little better than Walmsley

Kipchoge is 1000 times better than Walmsley. Stop sneaking him in a conversation he will never belong in.

Kipchoge is the greatest marathoner ever and probably won't be surpassed in the next few decades although there are some guys currently at the top on the track that can dethrone him. That being said you cannot be the GOAT of distance running when you spent track and XC getting destroyed by a rival. Kipchoge has a terrible record against Bekele. I can't recall the number but it's something like 4-15. For gods sake the man had to move up to the marathon because he couldn't make the Kenyan 5000 or 10000 team while he was supposedly in his prime, just 27 years old.

ShilohDoesntCare wrote:

Kipchoge is the greatest marathoner ever and probably won't be surpassed in the next few decades although there are some guys currently at the top on the track that can dethrone him. That being said you cannot be the GOAT of distance running when you spent track and XC getting destroyed by a rival. Kipchoge has a terrible record against Bekele. I can't recall the number but it's something like 4-15. For gods sake the man had to move up to the marathon because he couldn't make the Kenyan 5000 or 10000 team while he was supposedly in his prime, just 27 years old.

but as someone quoted Haile, marathon is the king of distance running. If you dominate marathon, you dominate distance running, anything else is hubris and nobody cares about track and XC.

Geb, Terget, Bekele, Sihine, Tadese, Cheptegei. Kamworor and even Kipchoge himself care about it.

robert678 wrote:

Bekele is clearly a bigger talent and the track and xc GOAT. Kipchoge is easily the marathon GOAT with good but not all-timevgreat track credentials.

I feel like you need to give the nod to Kipchoge because of the consistency and longevity. Bekele was the best from 2003-2009, but was very inconsistent afterwards and was never again the best in the world. Kipchoge was the best in the world from 2014-2021 and 2nd best in 2013, and very good from 2003-2011 on the track but like Bekele after 2009 was never the best in the world during this time. They are very similar, but Kipchoge also had his dominance in an era where all the biggest talents go to the marathon. The marathon is the hardest event to dominate. Haile once said "marathon is the king of the distances". I agree with that. Kipchoge > Bekele.

Haile also said the 10k is the ultimate test of stamina and endurance. The thing is: he talks a lot.

Bolt is the greatest sprinter right? Well he never did anything in the 400. The marathon is a very distinct event, far different than the 5/10/xc which I think are more similar than different.

If being the goat means greatest all around distance talent, then it seems Bekele is still the goat.

If being the goat means being better at your optimal distance race vs any other at theirs, now the conversation is more interesting.

I think you could reasonably argue, especially if he wins again in Paris, that Kipchoge is/was better at the marathon than Bekele was at xc or the 10K. It would be a close call.

Saying that Bekele beat Kipchoge on the track so he must be the goat would be like saying that van Niekerk or Johnson are greater than Bolt because they would destroy him at the 400.

Yes, Kipchoge was flailing away at the 5 K (if you can call it flailing to win a wc, two Olympic medals and run 12:46) when all along he was a latent greatest marathoner. He and the rest of the world just did not know it yet.

Another goalpost moved. A few years ago, they said he has to repeat as Olympic champion, I tough ask even I thought he wouldn't be able to. The truth is, no one's mind is getting changed. However, the fact remains, his sub-2 efforts transcended the sport and seeped into the mainstream in ways few others have managed. And interestingly, he remains the face of the sport while the media tries and, yet again, fails, to find and crown Bolt's replacement.

El Keniano wrote:

Another goalpost moved. A few years ago, they said he has to repeat as Olympic champion, I tough ask even I thought he wouldn't be able to. The truth is, no one's mind is getting changed. However, the fact remains, his sub-2 efforts transcended the sport and seeped into the mainstream in ways few others have managed. And interestingly, he remains the face of the sport while the media tries and, yet again, fails, to find and crown Bolt's replacement.

I agree. Bolt is still the sport’s biggest star ever, certainly in the last 50 years. Maybe Jesse Owens was a greater and more important star than Bolt. Hard to compare. Kipchoge is 2nd. Bekele is a global nobody. What’s Bekele’s q rating? The global face of distance running, to casual fans and non fans is Kipchoge by far. Should this factor into goat status, maybe not, but distance runnings greatest star is Kipchoge and all the rest are a very distant 2nd.

Being better on the track = better runner. Track has always and still does attract the deepest field, despite all the money on the road right now. In the marathon, it's filled with some random guys who may be good for only a year or two (or even one good marathon only). You can't seriously say guys like Adola and Geremew are better runners than Cheptegei, Jacob, Barega, not to mention that Bekele were competing in the Golden era of track, against guys like Sihine, Shaheen, Tadese and even Kipchoge himself.

As for being better at your optimal distance race, I would also say Bekele has the edge. Four times WC 10k and winning streaks, Five-times cross-country winning streaks (long+short), Double 10k Olympic Gold, (5k+10k Double Gold in Beijing). You might say there are more variables in the marathon but let's not forget Kipchoge only races like 2 marathons a year and all of them are flat courses, I think that just evens things out. If anything I would argue things can go wrong more easily in cross-country races than in well-prepared, flat marathons.

And yeah, range is really important when we're talking about DISTANCE GOAT.